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 Posted: Wed May 13, 2009 11:04 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | There is no law that states a person has to report a claim to their carrier. |
no there isn't..but her policy is not ambigous at all..I think mine says, 'promptly report'...her's says, 'as soon as possible after an occurance.' As soon as possible would be as soon as you had access to a phone...
I think her carrier is on solid ground...we also don't know the demand and only think there isn't a p.d. claim...If the injuried party had a 1 or 2k deductible her carrier wouldn't have paid, (if the damage was less than the deductible) thus no subro..and the pd could be in the atty's demand letter buried in his/her demand amount.
I disagree that she hasn't compromised the claim...re: physical, and witness evidence in her late report...I don't see bad faith here at all, and think her policy is quite clear...but certainly wouldn't blame the OP for running by an attorney..
Chris, how much was the demand from the attorney? and did it go into specifics?
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Lori
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| Posted: Wed May 13, 2009 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | we also don't know the demand and only think there isn't a p.d. claim |
I have no doubt that there is a PD claim. I'd say it must be minor otherwise the other party would have been more motivated to report the loss.
| Quote: | | I disagree that she hasn't compromised the claim...re: physical, and witness evidence in her late report...I don't see bad faith here at all, and think her policy is quite clear...but certainly wouldn't blame the OP for running by an attorney. |
While it's certainly possible, I'm just doubting that anything has changed. A police report was filed so any witnesses would be listed. Liability is not being disputed, the OP admits to what happened. I could see the denial standing if the other party had their vehicle repaired with no good documentation of the damages after the loss.
Unless the other party waited this long to secure an attorney, the attorney made a HUGE mistake in not reporting the claim to the OP's carrier sooner. I'm guessing the other party wait 8 months before obtaining an attorney as it would make almost no sense for the attorney not to send out a representation letter right away. If the denial stands the attorney only chance of getting paid is through his clients UMBI if she has this or a kick back on a Bad Faith claim. I doubt this is the type of attorney willing to wait out a bad Faith claim for a few bucks. So I'm guessing either the attorney is an idiot and/or he/she was just retained recently. If the other party waited 8 months to secure the use of an attorney then I'm guessing her injuries are very minor. As such, if GEICO sticks to their denial, the other party may just go away.
I'm having a hard time figuring out who screwed up more on this claim. |
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tcope
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| Posted: Wed May 13, 2009 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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Unfortunately for the OP its probably going to take a Bad Faith claim against GEICO to do this. However, it could also amount to some money going to the OP as well as the other party.
What is a bad faith claim? And how can I go about filing for this?
Should I Wrtre to the NYS Ins Dept or the Consumer Services Bureau?
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If the other party waited 8 months to secure the use of an attorney then I'm guessing her injuries are very minor. As such, if GEICO sticks to their denial, the other party may just go away.
I was thinking they might just go away too, but I realize that I screwed up and if there is anything I should be doing to try to minimze my losses I want to do it NOW. If I wait and see what the other party does, will that hurt me? Is there a time period that a bad faith claim needs to be made?
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I have no doubt that there is a PD claim. I'd say it must be minor otherwise the other party would have been more motivated to report the loss.
What is a PD claim? I have no idea what they are asking for. I spoke to geico over the phone and they told me she was suing for pain and suffering.
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| Posted: Wed May 13, 2009 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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In this situation a Bad Faith claim is when you pay for coverage/protection, it's not provided, and you suffer a loss because of it.
If you are sued and a judgement is won, you'd file a Bad Faith claim against your carrier as they were required to provide you coverage and did not. That is, they acted in Bad Faith in not providing the coverage that they should have. Basically is a breach of the contract but there are bad faith laws on the books that make a Bad Faith claim easier to prove. I'm not an attorney and laws differ but you need to show that you've been harmed by GEICO's incorrect denial. This may only happen if a judgement is won against you but it might also be possible if you can show that you suffered mentally or physically from the denial. Of course, a judgement speaks for itself and it much easier to show as a loss then something mental. Usually what happens in these cases is the injured person's attorney obtains a judgement and then they will be happen to refer you to a Bad Faith attorney that will handle your Complaint against your carrier. If the carrier settles, then the injury attorney gets them to pay your judgement and probably gets a kick back from the bad Faith attorney. But most injury attorneys don't pursue a judgement as there is no quick money in it. So it's doubtful that this will go anywhere.
A PD claim is a a Property Damage claim.
I don't know much about this situation and I've been wrong before but I _really_ think you have a good case against GEICO in that they should be affording coverage. |
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tcope
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| Posted: Wed May 13, 2009 7:12 pm Post subject: |
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| This is where I hate insurance companies. They always try to skip out on paying with any opportunity exist. This sounds do bogus and I would change companies promptly and not give them any business. I would call the attorney general, I would call the bbb.org, I would call the department of insurance in your state and not stop there. Look over your entire paperwork and find out where it states that information and even ask an adjuster to show you. Then, find out how long it took for them to get you the proper information as well. Did the notify you promptly, did they wait or what happened? You may also have to get a lawyer involved to help you sort things out as well. I wouldn't let this company take another penny from you. Companies need to help drivers or clients when they are in trouble or need. This is when a driver needs help and advise at the most, they seem to thrive on this and it makes me very sick! Get a new auto insurance company, one who is willing to stand behind you when you are down and is willing to help you in need. This is bogus and upsetting to me! |
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justong
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| Posted: Wed May 13, 2009 10:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I'm having a hard time figuring out who screwed up more on this claim. |
I'm with you on that one....but for the love of george, paul, john and ringo..if an ambulance hauls off someone you just rearended....wouldn't 'something' tell you to report the claim?  Sorry but I think the OP's the hands down winner in this race.
| Quote: | | This is where I hate insurance companies. They always try to skip out on paying with any opportunity exist. This sounds do bogus and I would change companies promptly and not give them any business. I would call the attorney general, I would call the bbb.org, I would call the department of insurance in your state and not stop there. |
Ok, Just, are you really saying that the OP had no obligation to let her carrier know that she rearended someone that left the accident scene in an ambulance? seriously? bbb, and dept of ins. won't do a thing on this...unless and until she can prove bad faith, T and I disagree, I don't see any bad faith, and think her policy language is VERY clear...and she didn't hold up her end of the agreement... | Quote: | | Look over your entire paperwork and find out where it states that information and even ask an adjuster to show you. |
why don't you read a couple of posts back, she posted the letter of denial which has the policy/contract language in it, showing their reason for denial.. | Quote: | | Then, find out how long it took for them to get you the proper information as well. |
WHAT? they denied it quickly after they were made aware of the claim 250 days after the accident..what are you talking about? | Quote: | | Did the notify you promptly, did they wait or what happened? |
again....WHAT? | Quote: | | This is bogus and upsetting to me! |
Just, what do you think this thread is about?
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Lori
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| Posted: Wed May 13, 2009 10:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Sorry but I think the OP's the hands down winner in this race. |
Yes, knowing that now I agree. It was "omitted" initially and I was under the "impression" that it was a light tap with no damage. Yeah... someone getting hauled off to the hospital might just warrant a call the the insurance company.[quote]I think it's very clear as well and there is no question that the OP waiting way too long and never reported the claim. But that is not the issue. The issue is if GEICO was harmed in some way by this delay.
If I was the adjuster my first reaction would to be pissed. It's just plain stupidity that the OP never reported the accident. Now I'm left to get information that is 250 days old in order to properly defend the OP. The second thing I'd do is to sent a risk alert so the OP's policy was not renewed. Fourth thing is that I'd send a Reservations of Rights letter. But then I'd start the investigation to see what info was available. I'm betting GEICO did not take their investigation very far and if not, how do they know their rights were affected? Take everything GEICO could have had the day after the accident and ask if it can be obtained now. If it can, then what has changed? If nothing then how has GEICO been hurt in anyway? If GEICO has not been harmed by the late report then they are denying the claim only because they can. Any judge/jury is going to see that the GEICO is collecting a premium and not offering coverage simply based on a few words in a policy. The _real_ question the judge is going to look at is why the wording is there. |
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tcope
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| Posted: Thu May 14, 2009 12:23 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | If GEICO has not been harmed by the late report then they are denying the claim only because they can |
I agree and would've had the same four steps as you if I got this claim...the problem is I think they can...should they? maybe not..if the clmt still has their vehicle and the insureds vehicle is still in the same shape (no new impacts to either)...then most likely they weren't harmed...and I agree, they should've investigate this, if they didn't...but investigating it too could've 'implied coverage'...(i'm not agreeing just saying)...and I'm betting that's why they denied it out of the gate, (if they did...she didn't say how long after she reported it they denied it).. | Quote: | | Any judge/jury is going to see that the GEICO is collecting a premium and not offering coverage simply based on a few words in a policy. |
The other question is how are these words any different than other policy conditions Todd? Clearly the state the OP is in allows this in the policy...How are these words any different than say, ''we will not cover an intentional act?" those too are just words... 
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Lori
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| Posted: Thu May 14, 2009 12:53 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | How are these words any different than say, ''we will not cover an intentional act?" those too are just words |
The section that they are locate in and the intent of those sections. Reporting a claim is not in the coverage or exclusion section... its in the Conditions sections, not under Exclusions. Take a look at some of the other items in the Conditions sections. It states that the insured must cooperate. If the insured does not return a few phone calls or respond to a few letters are you going to deny coverage? It states that the insured will assume no obligation or payment without the insureds consent. Are you going to deny a claim when the insured tells the other person that his/her insurance will pay for the damage? It states that the insured must immediately send copies of notices. Are you going to deny a claim when the insured does not send you an attorney rep letter "immediately"? Under Conditions the policy does state that the carrier has no duty to provide coverage if these duties are not met. But we all know that there is wording in the policy that does not hold up in court. The entire Conditions section is one of those things. GEICO is certainly within their rights to deny coverage. But this in no way means that it would hold up in court. |
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tcope
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| Posted: Thu May 14, 2009 3:06 am Post subject: insurance |
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| No...there IS no law you have to report a claim. But, if you KNOW there is an injury, then why NOT report it? The OP NOT reporting the cliam just makes her look bad..........especially if the other person was hurt in the accident. |
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sdchargersfan
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| Posted: Thu May 14, 2009 10:41 am Post subject: |
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The section that they are locate in and the intent of those sections. Reporting a claim is not in the coverage or exclusion section... its in the Conditions sections, not under Exclusions. Take a look at some of the other items in the Conditions sections |
I know you know I know that... my point was ''just words'' is ''just words''
| Quote: | | If the insured does not return a few phone calls or respond to a few letters are you going to deny coverage? |
Maybe, depends on the claim..first of course they would get a 'hey wake up, and call me' letter and a ROR ... then if no return call I'd close the claim...and let the clmts lawyer wake them up.. | Quote: | | But this in no way means that it would hold up in court. |
I agree or that it would not hold up..dice roll..
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Lori
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| Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:19 pm Post subject: |
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If I haven't heard anything from the attorney yet, do you think they just dropped it? If the other partys insuance paid the claim ,and then will be coming after me, how long would that take? Thanks for all the replies.
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chris2
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| Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 6:54 am Post subject: |
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Hello Chris and welcome back.
| Quote: | | If I haven't heard anything from the attorney yet, do you think they just dropped it? |
I'd say that's very unlikely. If they had to drop the case they wouldn't have persuaded it at the first place.
Have you heard anything from your carrier afterward? |
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JeremyHolter
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| Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 11:00 am Post subject: |
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However long the statute of limitations in your state is...that's how long they can wait. Maybe she didn't file a UM claim, or if she did she hasn't settled it yet. Remember though, if they do file suit even though your carrier denied your claim...get those suit papers to the claims dept within 24 hrs of receiving them. They may change their mind if a suit is filed.
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Lori
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| Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2009 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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Thank you for the reply. I didn't know that they might change thier mind. I haven't heard anything from anyone since they denied the claim. I'll post again if I do.
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