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 Posted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 3:50 am Post subject: |
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As I have been working on the MOTHER of all screwed-up cases involving wills and disgruntled beneficiaries, it's funny (ironic really) how this topic suddenly appeared in my Topic Reply Notification inbox.
Check this out:
Grandma and Grandpa are living very well in thier senior years. They owned a large business in the San Francisco Bay area and made tons of money when they sold it. Together, they have 4 sons and a number of grandchildren. Grandma dies at 63 years old and Grandpa remarries a wonderful woman (his age) 3 years later.
In her younger days, the new Grandma was unable to have children and grew very close to her nieces and nephews.
Grandpa dies in 2003 without a will or a trust and a net estate value in the mid-seven figure range. Grandma is suddenly coached by her sisters on the value of things like Wills and Trusts.
Grandma passed away last month and when her Will was read, it seems as though everything was left to her nieces, nephews, and their children. With the exception of one grandson, none of Grandpa's side of the family received anything.
It seems the one grandson had taken the time to visit on a regular basis, went hunting and fishing with his grandfather, sent Father's Day cards, etc., etc. He told me he wanted absolutely nothing from his grandfather except his wedding ring (from his first marriage) and Grandpa's gun collection.
Instead, he'll probably never have to work again and the rest of his side of the family is REALLY upset with him for being the only one anything was left to.
Damned if you do and damned if you don't.
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InsInvestigator
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| Posted: Wed Jul 15, 2009 10:21 pm Post subject: Will |
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So my dad passed away and had a will he stated that ALL money insurance money ect,ect is sapoce to go to his kids in his words with ALL and insurance in there clearly...
My dad was diegnosed with savere depression in 2004 he wrote the will in 2002 and changed the benferirie to his gf in 2006 does she still get the money knowing he was not of sound mind body n soul when he signed the benifire papers??
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amandamills
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 5:27 am Post subject: |
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Well Amanda, the beneficiary status mentioned in the policy document normally prevails over the will of the decedent. Hence, the insurance company would acknowledge the girlfriend as the beneficiary of your father since it was amended by the insured.
Now, if you would like to contest the beneficiary issue, you would need to challenge the same at the court of law where you would be required to prove that your father wasn't at sound state of mind when he made the changes. If you win, the money would then be paid to you according to the verdict. |
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kelvin
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 9:45 am Post subject: |
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Hi Amanda,
Do you possess any evidence which may prove that he was not of a sound mind when he changed the beneficiary?
If you have any such medical documents, it may come in handy in the court of law. Otherwise, things would go in their natural way!
Steven |
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steven
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| Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 9:25 pm Post subject: will versus beneficiary |
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If the decease had CD with totten trust name for beneficiary over the CD's (all accounts) and the will said to devide 50/50 between 2 people (one of which was named trust on accounts) Does the other one get anything or only the designated beneficiary trust
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theone
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| Posted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 12:46 am Post subject: |
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Well I'm confused...Start again...the will says what? and the trust says what?
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Lori
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| Posted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 6:08 am Post subject: |
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And your point is?
Mark (InsInvestigator) is spot on with his points on wills vs. life insurance beneficiaries. Any of the posts that equate the two or give supremacy to a will over a living life insurance beneficiary are, to be blunt, not worth reading.
Life insurance generally exists outside the realm of probate law, in which wills are firmly entrenched. But a careful reading of most life contracts will reveal much in common with probate law, especially when it comes to succession of beneficiaries and unusual situations such as simultaneous death or common disasters.
When an insured dies, the two remaining parties to the contract are the insurer and the beneficiary. Not the probate court or the wills and trusts lawyer. But policyowners have done many a strange thing when it comes to naming beneficiaries, perhaps at the insistence of an agent with as little understanding of the subject as some of the posters in this thread.
Vague beneficiary statements are the source of much contention over policy proceeds, but, again, it is entirely outside the probate process. Naming "All My Children" is inviting trouble in some of our complex family situations involving kids in the "his, hers, and ours" categories. And what about the heretofore unknown "love child" (a la John Edwards, absent the National Enquirer)?
How can you be certain that life insurance and wills are not on a collision course as some of the previous posts contend? Do a little research on the topic "spendthrift trust" -- where you'll discover that life insurance and retirement plan proceeds have similar and special protections which generally make them "invulnerable" to claims by creditors of the decedent, or those of the beneficiary (at least not before the money is in the hands of the beneficiary). And they are not subject to claims of or against the estate, unless there is no named beneficiary, or, worse yet, a person's beneficiary is named as "My Estate."
Any good book on wills and trusts will point out the significant differences between the two, and show how ownership of life insurance is sometimes placed in a trust, but should never be left in such a way that a will takes precedence (i.e., always having named primary and contingent beneficiary(ies), and regular client contact to make sure nothing has happened to warrant any product or face amount -- or beneficiary -- changes.
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MaxHerr
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| Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 2:21 am Post subject: last wish on your death bed |
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If you had a young man that knew he was dying but did not take the time to change his beneficaries on his insurance policy but tells his family to give everything to his live in partner on his dying bed should that be honored? The policy's was put in place 10yrs before the death of the person when he first statred his job and he spent the last 4 yrs of his life with his live-in fiancee. There was more than one policy in place, one for his sister's kids because he thought that the mother would be single all her life but she was married for a few years when he died and the other was for his mother. He was helping his fiancee raise her young son since birth and they were living in a house that he had just bought for her. He died and she was left with nothing. Should that have happened or because of the contract they were bound by law to keep the money for themselves?
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sweetceya
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| Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 2:41 am Post subject: |
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Families can, and will, do as they please. But life insurance money is payable to a named beneficiary or the policyowner when the insured dies. Since most insureds are the policyowner, when they die without naming a beneficiary, the life insurance money is paid to their estate, where the probate court will (or may) get involved. When that happens, the law will determine where the money goes. Unmarried persons may not have as strong a claim as family members.
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MaxHerr
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| Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 3:06 am Post subject: The "Will" |
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I was named in the will as the exec. Im told to give my brother $100 if he can be found. My mothers insurance has him listed as a beneficiary. The will clearly states she gave me everything & Im in charge. Do I have to give my brother 1/2? I have called him, left messages and no reply. What now?
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anybody
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| Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:07 am Post subject: |
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If you know what your brother's mailing address is, as executor and on his behalf, you file the death claim for the policy of which he is beneficiary, and the insurance company will send him the check -- and you've met your responsibility as far as that item goes. Whatever else you need to do as executor, you do, with or without his advice or consent. You should document your attempts to give him notice, such as sending letters via Certified With Return Receipt or Registered Mail, both of which require signatures to deliver, or they will be returned to you marked "undeliverable" or "unclaimed".
Your fiduciary duty as executor is to follow all the instructions presented in the will as best you lawfully can. Are you doing this yourself, or do you have legal counsel?
If you cannot locate your brother at this time, then whatever is supposed to be "his" probably needs to be placed in a trust for him until such time as he appears to claim his "stuff". As executor of your mother's estate, you have the legal standing to proceed in that manner, subject to the approval of the probate court.
If the will says anything about "equal shares" or some other type of distribution arrangement, that's what you have to do.
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MaxHerr
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