Can an insurance company insist on taking possesion of a total loss vehicle?

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 12:05 pm   Post subject:   

If your home is destroyed in a tornado and the insurance company gives you a full settlement, does that mean that they own your house? Would you have to pay them for rebuilding on the same property? Again, nowhere in the policy or in state law does it say that the insurance companies automatically gains ownership of your car if they pay you ACV.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 12:20 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
If your home is destroyed in a tornado and the insurance company gives you a full settlement, does that mean that they own your house? Would you have to pay them for rebuilding on the same property?
Of course not but there is a big difference between not only the policys but 'real' vs 'personal' property....
Quote:
Again, nowhere in the policy or in state law does it say that the insurance companies automatically gains ownership of your car if they pay you ACV.
Are they buying the car from you? Yes, they are..therefore if they purchase the vehicle they are the owners...I'd do some checking in next couple of days, and get the laws for you...(too much 'real' work today WinkRolling Eyes )


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 3:21 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
Are they buying the car from you? Yes, they are


You made this statement without having any evidence to back it up. BTW, I have asked many SF employees high up in the company and they all said "There is nowhere in the policy that states that we own your car after we pay you the ACV or that you owe us a salvage fee if you decide to keep your car. It is just always done that way." I'm sorry but I don't accept that as an answer.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:04 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
I'm sorry but I don't accept that as an answer.
That's ok, it wasn't a full answer...remember...I said,
Quote:
I'd do some checking in next couple of days, and get the laws for you...(too much 'real' work today )


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 11:20 pm   Post subject:   

Ok, sorry, it took me about five minutes..



You said....

Quote:
You made this statement without having any evidence to back it up.
In response to me saying
Quote:
Are they buying the car from you? Yes, they are..therefore if they purchase the vehicle they are the owners




So here ya' go....This shows that you MUST sign over ownership (ie selling the car to the carrier).





MO standard auto police says regarding coverages F&G (collision and comp), under the heading, Claim Settlements...
Quote:
"If we elect to pay the comparable value of any item we will do so only if the owner of that items signs and delivers to us all legal documents we may request to give us full ownership of it..."




and (cause I know it's coming)



Comparable Value means:

Quote:
a)The depreciated worth of the vehicle or part imeediately before the accident

b) plus any sales tas, luxury vehicle tax based on the depreicated worth of the vehicle or part immediately before the accident

c)plus any other taxes or fees you must incur to acquire ownership of another auto or part to replace the damaged vehicle or part with one of equal value.


Same as ACV really...I don't know why they changed it but they did a few years ago...



Here's the thing..if it were not in the policy you can bet your bottom dollar it wouldn't happen ON EVERY SINGLE TOTAL LOSS SETTLEMENT...Now, I don't know who up high in SF you talked to but if you talked to someone in claims, they should know this...As you know most policys are standardized...If you want tell me again your state, and I'll try and pull a standard policy for that...



Now of course if a person fails or refuses to sign over a clear title (and have had this happen it's lost or something) then the adjuster issues payment to the owner MINUS the salvage value, and they retain it...OR if they have the title refuse to sign it over, and do not want to retain (and pay) for salvage value then the claim just isn't paid..


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 12:30 pm   Post subject:   

First of all, I do appreciate you answering these questions. However, my KY policy does not state anything like your MO policy. I have since learned that the TN policy states something very similar to your MO policy. So, I agree that if the policy states what you are saying then there would not be any question as to what has to take place. But currently my KY policy does not state anything about the insurer becoming the owner after paying ACV and/or mention anything about a Salvage Retention charge. Even though we have asked repeatedly that State Farm show us where it states this kind of information they cannot. Even the Dept. of Insurance cannot show us in KY law where these kinds of statements exist even though they can misquote sections of law from memory. Yes I did say misquote, because they will tell you one thing but then cannot show you the section of the law that it came from. Also, I have spoken to the Claims Representative, his supervisor, and so on all the way up to the VP of Claims for KY,TN & OH. When I asked them about what we are discussing they just said that it is not in the policy but is in internal documentation but that they cannot show us those documents because they are work product. Maybe this information is in policies given out in other states but it is not in KY's policy. Our agent's assistant even said, well you should be seeing an addendum soon then.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 12:42 pm   Post subject:   

Laughing
Quote:
even though they can misquote sections of law from memory. Yes I did say misquote, because they will tell you one thing but then cannot show you the section of the law that it came from.
Laughing ain't that the truth! Wink



It would be really odd that a company as large (number one!) as SF wouldn't have themselves protected..I'm sure they do... Wink I'm betting that there are laws on all the books (somewhere) that cover this...you can bet it's been challenged....I have never heard of a company ever settling a total loss without getting title...or of some charge (some times it can be just the tow and storage) for owner retain.



What he's talking about internal documents are like 'claims standards' or SOP's etc....





I am however surprised that it isn't right there in the policy, I have no access to a state farm policy so can't ''look between the lines'' (there is actually an knack to reading those darn things! Rolling Eyes )



I'll try and do some noising around KY law this weekend and see if I can find anything....


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 2:37 pm   Post subject:   

I can help you out regarding KY law.

806 KAR 12:095. Unfair claims settlement practices for property and casualty insurance. (Section 7, SF has never offered a replacement vehicle and we have not deviated from section 1)

KRS 186A.530, when you read section 3 keep in mind that my vehicle has not been transfered to SF and that we are keeping the vehicle. Section 7(b) refers to my situation.

Google "Kentucky Revised Statutes"


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 4:39 pm   Post subject: car totaled?  

I have recently had a fender bender in my 97 mitsubishi eclipse. It has 145,000 miles. The KBB value is $3200 and I just had an estimate done for $2700. I live in Indiana. I am wondering if my car will be considered a total salvage? It is driveable. I just talked to the ins company and they are sending an adjustor out to take a look. I am new to this and am wondering if they say it is fixable whether I should challenge that decision. I would rather it be totaled out so I can use that money towards a new vehicle. Any advice would be appreciated!!



Thanks!


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 4:39 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
BTW, I have asked many SF employees high up in the company and they all said "There is nowhere in the policy that states that we own your car after we pay you the ACV or that you owe us a salvage fee if you decide to keep your car. It is just always done that way." I'm sorry but I don't accept that as an answer.
I think you need to consider that the insurance owes for the "loss" and that there is a definition of "loss". If the owner retains the salvage, should the value of the salavge be a part of the "loss". the policy does not state that it _will_ pay the ACV on the vehicle, it states that it will pay _up to_ the ACV for the "loss".



Can an insurance company insist on taking possesion of a total loss vehicle? Nope. can they then deduct the salvage value of that vehicle? Yup! As it's no longer part of the "loss".
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 11:34 pm   Post subject:   

Another great way to explain it T thanks....



Waiting in Indiana, Your vehicle may be a total loss. with the figures you have here, it's borderline, the adjuster may write a shorter or higher estimate...as it sets now it's on the edge....check NADA or Edmunds...no company I know of uses KBB....

Quote:
I am new to this and am wondering if they say it is fixable whether I should challenge that decision. I would rather it be totaled out so I can use that money towards a new vehicle. Any advice would be appreciated!!
It never hurts (in a very nice way) to say to the adjuster, 'ya' know I pretty much hope it totals, I'm ready for a new car'' some times we work so hard trying to save one, I ALWAYS like to know (and generally ask) which way an owner 'wants' it to go..total or fix....so let them know when he/she comes to look at your vehicle..


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 1:54 am   Post subject: car accident  

I was involved in a wreck today, the other person was at fault. I still owe 4600.00 on the car, kelly book has it valued around 5600.00 if its totalled how will i come out? How much will I get after paying off the loan? Im hoping it can be repaired.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 6:07 am   Post subject:   

Hi ioosw, the members have replied to the tread that you have on the same topic. I'm posting the url below for your convenience. Pls check the replies on it and ask the community back if you have more queries.



http://www.ampminsure.org/auto/total-car-loan.html#34465



Thanks,

Lakemen



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PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 11:40 am   Post subject:   

.

.



I'm more than a little curious...



In the quotes below... why are the terms "or part" and "of any item" included in these quotes??



What purpose could these added terms serve when settling a claim??



Quote:
MO standard auto police says regarding coverages F&G (collision and comp), under the heading, Claim Settlements... Quote:



"If we elect to pay the comparable value of any item we will do so only if the owner of that items signs and delivers to us all legal documents we may request to give us full ownership of it..."





and (cause I know it's coming)

Comparable Value means:



Quote:

a)The depreciated worth of the vehicle or part imeediately before the accident

b) plus any sales tas, luxury vehicle tax based on the depreicated worth of the vehicle or part immediately before the accident

c)plus any other taxes or fees you must incur to acquire ownership of another auto or part to replace the damaged vehicle or part with one of equal value.




Quote:
Now of course if a person fails or refuses to sign over a clear title (and have had this happen it's lost or something) then the adjuster issues payment to the owner MINUS the salvage value,


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 14, 2009 5:04 pm   Post subject: Value of suv  

I had an accident in my 2007 experdition el. It has close to 80,000 miles. I am not sure of the bb value of the car because there are none with the number of miles that i have. What percentage will the insurance company be willing to fix with a suv with this number of miles and when should it be considered totalled? Thanks!


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