| Message |
Author |
|
 Posted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 12:18 am Post subject: |
|
|
Dear Lori,
To date there has only been two (2) Internet Thread WARS that I have lost in my entire *SAFE carreer and this wasn't one of them because you can't claim victory without credible and verifiable facts which YOU my dear have not provided.
SHOW ME the difference in price from buying online or through an agent with the exact same company with the exact same contract.
SHOW ME.
For those of you who are wondering about my two losses both were on very, very, very extremely technical issues.
One was regarding an IRC Section 72t exception for SEPP prior to age 59 1/2 from qualified pension plans and the other was on this board regarding the actual crediting method of guaranteed interest on a company specific Indexed Univeral Life policy. I am eternally grateful for the posters who took me to the woodshed on those threads so that I may provide exactly correct information to my clients in the future.
Also Missy......you are quoting me out of context....I was specifically typing about LIFE INSURANCE not auto insurance when I made that quote before TLE ever asked about Progressive's online rates.
Back to the facts, SHOW ME the auto insurance policy proposal whereby auto insurance with Progressive is a differrent premium for the EXACT same contract and the only thing that was "different" was the method by which the policy was purchased.
SHOW ME!
ONLY then can you claim victory and I'll eat crow and have three (3) losses in my entire *SAFE carreer vs hundreds of victories with a winning percent of 99.9475896%
Pfffffffffffffffffffffffttt!
_________________
Gary Spicuzza, *SAFE
Copyright 1956.
No Rights Reserved.
*Self Appointed Financial Expert |
|
GarySpicuzza
Forum Expert
Joined: 03 Apr 2008
Posts: 959
Location: West Pasco County, FL
242.53 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 1:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | you can't claim victory without credible and verifiable facts which YOU my dear have not provided. |
But sweetie I did...since MY ONLY arguement is that the rates are NOT the same...and you have finally admitted that... | Quote: | | SHOW ME the difference in price from buying online or through an agent with the exact same company with the exact same contract. |
I already showed you that the site we were talking about has right there in their FAQ 'are the rates the same' NO they are NOT' what else sugar plum do you need? Also Missy......you are quoting me out of context.... | Quote: | | I was specifically typing about LIFE INSURANCE not auto insurance when I made that quote before TLE ever asked about Progressive's online rates. |
Were we to 'guess' that Gary? You might've been (talking only about life ins. which by the way is very convenient now) but no one else seemed to be...it was about insurance purchased on the web more specifically direct..(which IS different as you know)... | Quote: | | Back to the facts, SHOW ME the auto insurance policy proposal whereby auto insurance with Progressive is a differrent premium for the EXACT same contract and the only thing that was "different" was the method by which the policy was purchased. |
Tomorrow looks like (so far  and I'm sure I just ginx myself) a decent day...if so I will try and get quotes for you...however this was never my ascertian, my only ascertain was that the site (progressive in this case) clearly states the rates are 'different' and the reasons they are different...but i will do my best to try and run this down for you this week Gary...I have no idea the outcome...all I know is the INSURER (who surely knows more than you or I about their own product) states it's different... | Quote: | | ONLY then can you claim victory and I'll eat crow and have three (3) losses in my entire *SAFE carreer vs hundreds of victories with a winning percent of 99.9475896% |
Honey, whether you admit it or not (big surprise this is like pulling teeth from you)...You made an inaccruate statement, you have corrected it, I said it was not the same per the site, and there is no dispute about that...just for fun and to watch you squirm I'll see what I can do... I have zero idea what or which one will be more than the other...all i know (and have proven) IS THAT THEY ARE DIFFERENT...CONTRARY TO YOUR PRIOR STATEMENT....
| Quote: | | For those of you who are wondering about my two losses both were on very, very, very extremely technical issues. |
Thank heavens you cleared that up, NOW maybe I can get some sleep tonight! 
_________________
"Never, never be afraid to do what's right, especially if the well being of a person or animal is at stake. Society's punishments are small compared to the wounds we inflict on our soul when we look the other way." Martin Luther King Jr. |
|
Lori
Moderator
Joined: 10 Sep 2007
Posts: 8173
Location: Missouri
287.90 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 11:54 am Post subject: |
|
|
We obviously comprehend English differently too!
Lori writes:
| Quote: | | (progressive in this case) clearly states the rates are 'different' and the reasons they are different |
No they DO NOT clearly state the rates ARE different, they state double talk bllsht with their:
| Quote: | Why Rates May Vary
Some people prefer to shop for car insurance online for the convenience and immediacy. Others prefer the in-person counsel and personal attention of an insurance agent/broker.
At Progressive, you can choose how you want to buy your car insurance or other vehicle insurance: directly from us online or by phone, or through an independent agent/broker. The price you pay for insurance could vary depending on how you buy.
Since the Direct Business and the Agency Business make independent decisions about the expenses they incur and the prices of their products, buying direct or through an agent could result in different prices for Progressive policies.
If you buy through an agent/broker, your rate includes the commission paid to the agent/broker for selling the policy. If you buy directly from Progressive, the rate reflects the cost of building, staffing and maintaining the sales centers and marketing costs of the Direct Business.
Because each group makes different decisions about their businesses that result in different rates, you won't know which company provides the lowest rate for you until you obtain a quote from our Agency Business and from our Direct Business. An agent/broker may provide the lowest price for some customers, while the direct rate may be lower for others.
With any Progressive policy, you still receive the benefits and services Progressive offers to all its customers, including unparalleled 24/7 customer, claims and online service. |
Now,... Lori,.... since you are hung up on "rates MAY vary" or could vary depending on whether the client buys direct or through a Progressive agent....
PLEASE explain who on God's green Earth would go online to buy auto insurance whereby the end result was they actually PAID more money out of poket than if they would have bought from the local Progressive agent?
Who?
Who would do THAT?
Did you read and comprehend what TLE wrote?
| Quote: | | I was wondering if all these company's I see on TV that sell insurance on the internet and do not use an agent and they give a discount if you buy on line,does this hurt sales for some agents, and is it possible this could eliminate the agents job. |
| Quote: | | It just seems like if the insurance company can cut out the agent they will.Does it seem like they are trying when they offer a discount if you buy on line and whith them. can this hurt some agents that sell that type of insurance. |
| Quote: | | If they don't use the agent can they give a discount because they save money not paying the agent so they can lower the agents fee. |
| Quote: | | Does that also apply to car insurance. when companies like progressive sells without an agent and they sell direct. |
Now,.... Lori,.... how does one remotely comprehend TLE cares anything about your non issues?
He is specifically stating more than once that he believes the online rates are lower.
Progressive is doing nothing more than covering their misleading advertizing jack assterisk's from lawsuits once people actually find out buying online was MORE money out of their pocket.
Nobody would buy online if they knew the end result was they paid more money. That kind of kills that business model,.......doesn't it?
_________________
Gary Spicuzza, *SAFE
Copyright 1956.
No Rights Reserved.
*Self Appointed Financial Expert |
|
GarySpicuzza
Forum Expert
Joined: 03 Apr 2008
Posts: 959
Location: West Pasco County, FL
242.53 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 1:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Gary, | Quote: | Question
Are Progressive's online rates the same as rates from an agent?
Answer
No. Buying direct or through an agent could result in different prices for Progressive policies because those areas of our business make independent decisions about the expenses they incur and the prices of their products. |
| Quote: | | Progressive is doing nothing more than covering their misleading advertizing jack assterisk's from lawsuits once people actually find out buying online was MORE money out of their pocket. |
Ok so you're standing on YOUR statement that buying ONLINE is absolutely higher than buying from an agent..right? i mean after all you've said it several times...just want to be sure before i go to any (MORE) time and trouble...and are you saying this is only progressive or all carriers gary who's premium is higher online than with an agent? | Quote: | | Nobody would buy online if they knew the end result was they paid more money. That kind of kills that business model,.......doesn't it? |
then what on earth would be the purpose of them (or anyone else) selling online Gary? That makes no sense....and frankly (again) i've not seen any claim in a commercial from ANY carrier that says it's cheaper online, only that it may (for some) be more convenient...please solidify your statement that all or just progressive is ALWAYS higher to purchase online.
_________________
"Never, never be afraid to do what's right, especially if the well being of a person or animal is at stake. Society's punishments are small compared to the wounds we inflict on our soul when we look the other way." Martin Luther King Jr. |
|
Lori
Moderator
Joined: 10 Sep 2007
Posts: 8173
Location: Missouri
287.90 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 12:01 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | i've not seen any claim in a commercial from ANY carrier that says it's cheaper online, |
That's right!
I believe I've stated that several times on this thread.
So what are you arguing about?
_________________
Gary Spicuzza, *SAFE
Copyright 1956.
No Rights Reserved.
*Self Appointed Financial Expert |
|
GarySpicuzza
Forum Expert
Joined: 03 Apr 2008
Posts: 959
Location: West Pasco County, FL
242.53 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 1:14 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | So what are you arguing about? |
I'm not ... Please answer my question... are you standing by your multiple unilateral statements that all online premiums are higher than agent premiums or have you changed your stance on that too?
_________________
"Never, never be afraid to do what's right, especially if the well being of a person or animal is at stake. Society's punishments are small compared to the wounds we inflict on our soul when we look the other way." Martin Luther King Jr. |
|
Lori
Moderator
Joined: 10 Sep 2007
Posts: 8173
Location: Missouri
287.90 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 7:19 am Post subject: |
|
|
Insurance companies have been selling directly for a long time. There have been television advertisements for life insurance for as long as I can remember.
The Internet makes it easier for clients to bypass the agents. However, we will survive. Most people want to deal with other people when making a large purchase. Insurance can be a confusing subject. More people will buy direct than before because of the Internet, but most people will want appreciate being treated as an individual by an individual agent.
_________________
Free insurance sales lead SEO tips
Personal insurance
CT health insurance
insurance sales leads |
|
Alston
Preferred member
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 136
Location: Bridgeport, CT
41.26 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:16 am Post subject: |
|
|
Where's Dr. Phil when you need him? 
Interesting debate technique, Lori,... typing your words and then asking me if that's what I'm saying.
Here's my stand... I'll quote myself:
| Quote: | Back to the facts, SHOW ME the auto insurance policy proposal whereby auto insurance with Progressive is a differrent premium for the EXACT same contract and the only thing that was "different" was the method by which the policy was purchased.
SHOW ME!
ONLY then can you claim victory and I'll eat crow and have three (3) losses in my entire *SAFE carreer vs hundreds of victories with a winning percent of 99.9475896% |
Please...... no more opinions.
POST PROGRESSIVE'S PROPOSALS!
One from their online site.
One from a Progressive agent.
My money is on the Progessive agent that he/she will have the better price!
That's my STAND!
_________________
Gary Spicuzza, *SAFE
Copyright 1956.
No Rights Reserved.
*Self Appointed Financial Expert |
|
GarySpicuzza
Forum Expert
Joined: 03 Apr 2008
Posts: 959
Location: West Pasco County, FL
242.53 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 12:44 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Allow me to quote you Gary as you seem to forget
First this: | Quote: | TLE it IS insurance agents and agencies that own those online sites.What's sold online is "order taker" type insurance. Such as, term life insurance, auto insurance, Medicare supplements and very expensive guaranteed issue life insurance.
|
Which was incorrect...(and you quoted this one twice...or can you name the agent that owns the progressive, gieco, etc...websites, and get the commission from the 'direct' sale?) I attempted to correct with this post of my own.. | Quote: | | Not so in the P&C world Gary...If a customer buys on line (non-captive agent company, I'm not sure about captive), thru the main site (as you and TLE posted re: progressive as an example)...there is NO agent or agency affiliated with this site or purchase |
Then: | Quote: | | There's is no such thing as saving money because you bought over the phone or online |
| Quote: | | there is a price difference....it's MORE MONEY TO BUY ONLINE than through an agent. |
| Quote: | | There isn't any difference in price. |
| Quote: | | That's MY STAND...... |
I'll see if I can't get an agent quote today, (first)...now of course I will not tell him or her what the online quote is, so that they can lower their commission/price...no more than i would tell another agent...'that' would not be an accruate measurement....and I'm only going to request a quote on one vehicle.
Again, (and by now I KNOW this won't be the last time)...my entire beef with your posts were/are:
a/ agents and agencys do not own all of these sites (as you posted)
b/ there is a DIFFERENCE in the two quotes, I never said (cause I don't know) if they are higher or lower...you initially claimed they are the same..no difference...period...that's it...you have recanted both (i assume you have backed off the first one, you just chose to ignore that one ) so i honestly don't understand your issue other than the apparent inability to admit you posted in haste...(re: the above two topics only)....
Hopefully I can put this to rest..however for me it is at rest because they are clearly stating on their own site the prices are DIFFERENT.
_________________
"Never, never be afraid to do what's right, especially if the well being of a person or animal is at stake. Society's punishments are small compared to the wounds we inflict on our soul when we look the other way." Martin Luther King Jr. |
|
Lori
Moderator
Joined: 10 Sep 2007
Posts: 8173
Location: Missouri
287.90 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 2:43 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| 'I can tell you that if you quote health it is the same price, at least here in KS and MO, no matter how you get your plan. At least in theory that is the case, but an agent will find the RIGHT plan, which an online service can''t do for you. There are ways to combat the web-only companies, though. I work for commissionbuilder.com (shameless plug) and we allow health agents to give web quotes via a link on their website. It''s not pricey, and it keeps the agents current in this tech world. |
|
HealthGuy
New member
Joined: 04 Feb 2009
Posts: 4
Location: Overland Park, KS
2.37 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:11 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Thanks HealthGuy, and welcome to the community...
_________________
"Never, never be afraid to do what's right, especially if the well being of a person or animal is at stake. Society's punishments are small compared to the wounds we inflict on our soul when we look the other way." Martin Luther King Jr. |
|
Lori
Moderator
Joined: 10 Sep 2007
Posts: 8173
Location: Missouri
287.90 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 9:17 am Post subject: it shouldnt be |
|
|
i won't think it will ever eliminate the job of an agent. just think that when there is any claim who is going to assist in the settlement of the claim,
are the robots going to come & settle it on behalf of you? or all those TV commercial poster boys going to settle down the big process & help you out in the claim process.
i think you have got the answer. |
|
amit
Senior member
Joined: 25 Jan 2009
Posts: 366
8.19 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Here's my stand... I'll quote myself:
| Quote: | | Back to the facts, SHOW ME the auto insurance policy proposal whereby auto insurance with Progressive is a different premium for the EXACT same contract and the only thing that was "different" was the method by which the policy was purchased. |
SHOW ME!
 Lori, why are you refusing to post this price "difference" here online? 
This is the 3rd time I've requested you back up your opinion with credible and verifiable information and you're still beating the dead horse issue.
Could it possibly be there isn't any price difference?
For the general public who may read this thread and purchase any form of insurance online. THAT is a sales method whereby the insurance company can legally rob you by having you screw yourself.
You have no legal recourse when the policy fails to perform as "thought" or the coverage proves to be inadaquate. A "lawyer" in court would say the agent knew or should have know that combination of coverages wasn't suitable for your situation.
You have no such cause of action because YOU did it to yourself.
_________________
Gary Spicuzza, *SAFE
Copyright 1956.
No Rights Reserved.
*Self Appointed Financial Expert |
|
GarySpicuzza
Forum Expert
Joined: 03 Apr 2008
Posts: 959
Location: West Pasco County, FL
242.53 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | i won't think it will ever eliminate the job of an agent. |
I don't think so either, and sure hope not... | Quote: | just think that when there is any claim who is going to assist in the settlement of the claim,
are the robots going to come & settle it on behalf of you? |
Same ones that do it now adjusters...  most agents don't handle ANY claims some have some minor draft authority on first party claims but by and large adjusters/claims dept handle claims not agents... | Quote: | | or all those TV commercial poster boys going to settle down the big process & help you out in the claim process. |
what?
_________________
"Never, never be afraid to do what's right, especially if the well being of a person or animal is at stake. Society's punishments are small compared to the wounds we inflict on our soul when we look the other way." Martin Luther King Jr. |
|
Lori
Moderator
Joined: 10 Sep 2007
Posts: 8173
Location: Missouri
287.90 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:28 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | Lori, why are you refusing to post this price "difference" here online? |
Cause I haven't done it yet Gary, sorry I have a real job too you know... the online quote is nothing...but as you should know an agent quote takes longer...and I haven't even looked for one yet... | Quote: | | This is the 3rd time I've requested you back up your opinion with credible and verifiable information and you're still beating the dead horse issue. |
dude for the umteenth time, it's not my opinion it's what the site says....are the prices the same? NO...That's what the site says...not lori! | Quote: | | For the general public who may read this thread and purchase any form of insurance online. THAT is a sales method whereby the insurance company can legally rob you by having you screw yourself |
come on gary that's b.s. and you know it. | Quote: | | You have no legal recourse when the policy fails to perform as "thought" or the coverage proves to be inadaquate. A "lawyer" in court would say the agent knew or should have know that combination of coverages wasn't suitable for your situation. |
more b.s. gary...first of all you think there are no e&o policys for the online bids? didn't you say at one time you don't feel it necessary to carry one yourself or was that someone else? geeeeeze...
i'll do my darnest to find a progressive agent and get a quote from the road today i'll hopefully get one that can email it, cause i don't have the time to go pick one up...then the online quote will be easy...
_________________
"Never, never be afraid to do what's right, especially if the well being of a person or animal is at stake. Society's punishments are small compared to the wounds we inflict on our soul when we look the other way." Martin Luther King Jr.
Last edited by Lori on Fri Feb 06, 2009 4:28 pm |
|
Lori
Moderator
Joined: 10 Sep 2007
Posts: 8173
Location: Missouri
287.90 Dollars($)
|
|
Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 Next 
