| Message |
Author |
|
 Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 6:47 pm Post subject: I backed into my neighbor's car 10 days ago. |
|
|
| No one answered door, so I left a note on the car with my info. Never heard from the neighbor, but the car disappeared after a couple of days (they have 5 other cars). A note on my door last night revealed that they sold the car and lost $300 on the sale due to the damage. They attached a repair estimate for $1000, but only seek $300. I don't mind paying for the damage, but they did not give me an opportunity to file the claim, in which case I would not have to pay out of pocket. Is this suspicious? |
|
muttmommie
New member
Joined: 02 Sep 2010
Posts: 6
2.81 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 9:41 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I'd say it's odd if nothing else. I'm guessing that they were going to sell the vehicle anyway and did not want to hassle with having it repaired. They probably obtained the estimate and then sold the vehicle. If it was an older vehicle and minor damage they probably did not take a loss in the sale value anyway. However, this does not negate their right to collect for the damages themselves. They could have certainly obtained an estimate and asked you to pay before they sold the vehicle.
The question is... was the damage $300 or more? pretty much any dent would cost that much. |
|
tcope
Forum Expert
Joined: 22 Nov 2006
Posts: 5065
Location: Salt Lake City, UT
272.43 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:43 am Post subject: |
|
|
Yes, the note claimed that they had a buyer for the car before the damage, and that the Buyer asked for only $300 off the sales price even though the damage estimate was $1000. So, the neighbor's only "loss" is the $300 he claims he lost in the sale transaction. I'm not disputing that I am liable for the damage to the vehicle. The problem I have is that I was not given the opportunity to file an insurance claim so that I would not be paying out of pocket or having to deal with any "shenanigans". Certainly, the benefit of just paying the $300 without a claim is that my insurance premium will not be penalized, but that's beside the point. The option to either pay out of pocket for the damage, or have the claim filed against my insurance should have been MY OPTION....not theirs.
To add to the suspicion here, I discovered today that the note was written by the the owner's sister, who is "Customer Service Representative" for a local State Farm Agent. So, obviously, they KNEW the proper procedure for handling this matter and chose to go around it. |
|
muttmommie
New member
Joined: 02 Sep 2010
Posts: 6
2.81 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:52 am Post subject: vehicle model |
|
|
By the way, Tcope, you are correct. It was an older vehicle (1999 Eclipse) and the damage was minor (dent to the driver side door). The estimate included labor to paint the mirror and repair "ground effects"....whatever that is.
I'm not saying I wouldn't have offered to pay for the damages out of pocket as opposed to filing a claim against my policy IF THEY HAD approached me from the beginning about the sales transaction they were in the process of, but it irks me that I wasn't given the option. My car is newer....an 08 hardtop convertible. So, if I repair the scratch made, I'm out of pocket for damage to both vehicles. |
|
muttmommie
New member
Joined: 02 Sep 2010
Posts: 6
2.81 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 1:49 am Post subject: |
|
|
You might just want to add some misery to their situation and refuse to pay. Let them take you to Small Claims Court and have to prove their damages. Be sure to keep the "note" that asks for just $300, in case they're tempted to sue for more.
If you haven't notified your insurance company of the collision, you should do so right away. At least they'll be aware of it. Let them know the details, that the vehicle has been "sold" and you have no way to make it available for their inspection. That will also be good documentation if you have to go to court.
Put the ball back in your neighbor's court and see which way it goes from there.
_________________
California-licensed Property & Casualty Broker-Agent and Life & Health Agent. CA Insurance License #0596197. Send me your questions, and I'll send you my answers. I live, breathe, and teach insurance! |
|
MaxHerr
Moderator
Joined: 29 Nov 2009
Posts: 4218
Location: Pomona CA
162.55 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 1:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
sounds like you are coming out good. I'd pay the $300 and thank my neighbor, maybe even involve a steak dinner. i wouldnt want to file an insurance liability claim for $300 bucks and risk my rates going up.
besides, you got to live next door to the guy. do you really want to balk over damage you admitted to, and settling for 30% of what you could have owed is a deal. tcope nailed it, any dent is worth $300...theres a lot of things that have to come off that door and be put back on to properly repair and refinish, and if they have to blend paint into adjacent panels for color match, its even more...not to mention the rental for a couple days you would have owed.
seems he is being fair to me. im guessing that if he were keeping the car he would have let you file insurance, but since he sold it, he may figured he's doing you a favor. i'd have to agree.
regarding your last statement: youre out of pocket for both vehicles because you caused the damage, regardless of what you drive. sry it irks you that they didnt involve you, but you can always file with your insurance. that option is still on the table. keep in mind, your neighbor graciously gave you the option of paying $300 instead of $1000, was he supposed to delay a buyer for his car (and potentially lose the sale) so you could file a claim over $300? |
|
mbyork
Preferred member
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 171
Location: Georgia
30.66 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 1:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
I was going to add . . .
It strikes me as this might be the tip of an iceberg known as insurance fraud. Collect a few hundred from you in cash. Then turn in a claim for damages under uninsured motorist coverage claiming the vehicle was hit by a hit-and-run driver in another location. Maybe even "enhance" the damage to collect a larger amount of money from their insurer. Less complicated things have happened.
And some fraudsters have been so brazen as to insure the vehicle repeatedly with different insurers and collect multiple claims for the same damage. Until they forget which companies they've tapped, and try it a second time with the same company.
_________________
California-licensed Property & Casualty Broker-Agent and Life & Health Agent. CA Insurance License #0596197. Send me your questions, and I'll send you my answers. I live, breathe, and teach insurance! |
|
MaxHerr
Moderator
Joined: 29 Nov 2009
Posts: 4218
Location: Pomona CA
162.55 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 2:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
small claims court, max? once the neighbor presents the note she left admitting to the damage, she'll incure the repair fees of $300, court fees, and possibly more expenses for the neighbors time. i dont see it hard to prove she damaged it, a note from her, paint swap on the cars, a simple photo from the new buyer showing her car's paint, or simply look at the paint swap on her car.
dont forget, these folks have to live next door to each other. i think an amical settlement would be in her best interest. |
|
mbyork
Preferred member
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 171
Location: Georgia
30.66 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 2:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
| insurance fraud for $300 after he sold the car? doubtful, besides thats his problem, not hers. she is trying to cover herself here. she just needs document she paid for the damage. have the neighbor sign something that states "settled" if it makes you feel better. |
|
mbyork
Preferred member
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 171
Location: Georgia
30.66 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 2:26 am Post subject: |
|
|
| mbyork you seem to be missing the point. I am not trying to dodge paying for the repairs. I'm concerned about the "shiftiness". It doesn't make sense to me that a prospective buyer of the car would only ask for a $300 discount on the sales price of a car that, in the alternative, he could coordinate repairs through me, the current owner and my insurance company to restore the car. I mean, the car still has the dent in it, so the new buyer still has a damaged vehicle. Obviously its would be easier for me to pay $300 than $1000....but that is not the point. I don't want to be involved in any kind of fraud that they might be attempting. |
|
muttmommie
New member
Joined: 02 Sep 2010
Posts: 6
2.81 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 2:27 am Post subject: |
|
|
Who's to say the car has not been sold? It could just be hidden. Then file a claim for $1000+ for hit-and-run damage. Do that ten times with ten different insurers, that's $10,000, not $300. Take a look at some of my posts of CA Dept of Insurance press releases in the Insurance Fraud forum, and you'll see what kinds of things happen here.
You might not have experienced anything like it in Georgia, but as many as 50% of all auto insurance claims in CA may be fraudulent according to the Dept of Insurance.
Muttmommie . . . you won't be involved in any fraud, paying $300 or not. You might be a witness for the prosecution.
_________________
California-licensed Property & Casualty Broker-Agent and Life & Health Agent. CA Insurance License #0596197. Send me your questions, and I'll send you my answers. I live, breathe, and teach insurance! |
|
MaxHerr
Moderator
Joined: 29 Nov 2009
Posts: 4218
Location: Pomona CA
162.55 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 2:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
Also, my note was not addressed to anyone in particular....so how do I know the Buyer won't try to file some kind of claim against me too? I don't really know that the car was sold at all....that's just what they've told me. For all I know, they gave it to a relative while they file an uninsured motorist claim on their own policy (if they even had one). As I said, the family member that left me the note last night is employed by an auto insurance agency....I discovered that simply by googling the name on the note. I didn't know their names before then.
Also, your statement that I can file a claim for repairs to my vehicle is incorrect since, obviously, I would have to meet the deductible - so I am still out of pocket for both vehicles. |
|
muttmommie
New member
Joined: 02 Sep 2010
Posts: 6
2.81 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 2:35 am Post subject: |
|
|
| MaxHerr...our posts hit at the same time, so I hadn't yet seen yours. Your statement about California is very interesting. I live in Texas, but my neighbors moved here from LA. (Watts) |
|
muttmommie
New member
Joined: 02 Sep 2010
Posts: 6
2.81 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 2:58 am Post subject: |
|
|
Plenty of insurance fraud in Texas, too.
If you even suspect the potential for fraud, report it to your insurance company. They are supposed to investigate, and if they find any evidence that could support the possibility, then they have to notify the state Dept of Insurance, which will definitely investigate.
_________________
California-licensed Property & Casualty Broker-Agent and Life & Health Agent. CA Insurance License #0596197. Send me your questions, and I'll send you my answers. I live, breathe, and teach insurance! |
|
MaxHerr
Moderator
Joined: 29 Nov 2009
Posts: 4218
Location: Pomona CA
162.55 Dollars($)
|
|
| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 3:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
maybe i missed the point, my apologies. so lets assume they are trying to commit fraud and they are risking jail for $300. youre still on the hook becuase you caused the damage their vehicle and left a note in your handwriting admitting it. so do you want to settle for $300 so that it goes away...or continue to play detective and speculate? i assumed you wanted to settle the damage you caused.
max, im with you on the fruad, there is a lot out there. especially in CA. maybe there is more to this, but without a full blown investigation, statements, pulling the guys personal info to see if he has multiple claims filed in the past, its simply speculation. and in my experience, usually the person commiting fraud initiated the incident...dont forget, she hit him...but hey ive been wrong before. my advice is based what i would do. I'd pay the $300, thankful im not paying $1000, and be able to smile and wave at my neighbor when i pull in.
im standing by my correct statement, you can still file the claim. your insurance company will defend and pay the liability claim requested by your neighbor. (and investigate fraud if the feel something is awry) There is no deductible for liability. no out of pocket there. yes you would be out of pocket for damage to your car as that would fall under the collision portion of your policy and subject to deductible, but hey, cant really complain there...you were at fault and caused the damage to your car too. i cant see being upset becuase you are out of pocket for damage you caused...it really sucks, dont get me wrong, im sorry it happend to you...but what are you expecting to happen here? |
|
mbyork
Preferred member
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 171
Location: Georgia
30.66 Dollars($)
|
|
