Typically a carrier inspects a vehicle within 48-72 hours.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 4:57 am   Post subject:   

I have little doubt that many conversations _close_ to this take place every day. Though out some of that stuff and I'd say that _most_ referrals to DRPs sound just like that (lifetime warrenty is mentioned, no 48 hour wait to inspect the vehicle and the shop can start repairs right away, rental can be authorized immediately because the shop can start working immediately. But these are also _valid_ and perfectly legal reason's to use a DRP. Let's make it more clear... a DRP simply speeds up the process of paying on a claim. What is wrong with that? Your exaggerations are in that you make it sound like carriers drag their feet if the person does not use a DRP. Typically a carrier inspects a vehicle within 48-72 hours. From what I've seen, states usually give insurance companies 30 days to settle a claim unless they can show good reason for not being able to do this. Some other states give a carrier 5-10 days to inspect a vehicle. But in most cases vehicles are inspected _much_ more quickly (I've screwed up my fair share of inspections but mistakes are going to be made... they are not the norm).



Let's put this into perspective... a DRP saves a carrier about $100 per vehicle. So it's worth it to some carriers to push DRP's pretty hard, there is no doubt about that. But having the DOI fine a carrier for one complaint negates the value of sending numorous vehicles to a DRP. So it's just not worth crossing the line. But I _know_ it happens and I agree that some carriers press their adjusters too hard when it comes to DRP referrals. No doubt about that.



Still, DRPs are legal, it's fair commerce, and in _most_ cases it's win/win/win situation for the carrier, vehicle owner, and DRP.



Just a note... the last carrier is worked for used DRP's. I seldom mentioned these to anyone. Most of the DRPs were the local dealerships. As such, when someone told me they were going to one of those dealerships, I simply sent the inspection request over and it was a "DRP referal". The problem with DRP programs is when the insurance company does not do their part in monitoring DRP shops and pulling them off the list if they can't hold up their end of the agreement.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 11:36 am   Post subject:   

Quote:
Only a slight exaggeration:
That has to be the understatement of the post! Rolling Eyes You know that steering is a hugely hot topic (atleast in our state) all the carriers I know, (and I know ALOT)...have a drp script that also includes words like, ''your choice'' 'preserving customer choice'' etc....I'll say it again, I work for one of the top three auto giants....there are NO discounts at all on anything...all the car in my company are required to be inspected no later than 48 hours regardless of their location or drp or not....you and I know that withholding rental saying a non-drp repair etc, is not in line with the fair claims practice....The shops on the drp at my company have to have certain number or square feet, ins requirements, equipment, and trained techs, they can't even get on the program without all of this....as to the warranty in the five or so years I've been a drp rep, I have paid about six warranty's, I also had to remove some shops....the reps that refer vehicles are required to record their conversations to assure that the customer is not steered....so Mike your little made up cartoon is just that....you talk about T and I living in a dream world, I'm tellin' ya' buddy your hate has blinded you to what really goes on...I'm not dillusional and think that some carriers may over sell, but this very very rare...


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 3:29 pm   Post subject:   

The only slight exaggeration is with regard to referencing the DOI, commissioner, and legislators, but we all know how much insurance money is parlayed into those areas and how much money insurers spend on lobbying.

The scripts are not an exaggeration at all. They are verified by many consumers and shops alike. Why is there a movement by the three trade organizations that are primary in this state to enact legislation to prevent these types of steering? They reprensent the majority of shops that are on DRP programs and they are hollering the loudest about these word tracts and steering. It's okay to steer away from non drp shops but if you drink the kool aid they shouldn't be steering work away from you. The fact is that bean counters know how to play the industry to get them to work the cheapest and stab each other in the back to keep them infighting amongst themselves. The collision industry has so many factions, it's often discribed as try to herd cats to organize them.



The word tracts are intentionally misleading and scripted in that they can not be challenged as being entirely untrue but they give the consumer the indication that they must use the preferred shop?



So is your company, whether and employer or insurer, among the list at this link" http://www.justice.org/docs/TenWorstInsuranceCompanies.pdf



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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2008 3:42 pm   Post subject: Mike is right on target  

State Farm is fairly new at this game. I have three cars in my shop right now who's owners were told they would not pay for a tow unless it went to a Select Service shop. One of them drove his train wreck in because he didn't want to risk getting stuck with the tow bill. I have a family member who managed a collision repair shop for seventeen years, and now is an adjuster for one of the big three. Because he knows how to repair a vehicle, and the reinspectors don't, he is stuck between what he knows is right and "morphing" performance audits. Lori and T, do you become hardened to these things over time? Do you feel it is becoming harder to give consumers what they are entitled to? Maybe he is in the wrong line of work.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 11:34 am   Post subject:   

Quote:
So is your company, whether and employer or insurer, among the list at this link" http://www.justice.org/docs/TenWorstInsuranceCompanies.pdf
Nope, did your realize that list includes health, life etc?
Quote:
Our final

list includes companies across a range of different insurance fields, including homeowners and auto insurers,health insurers, life insurers, and disability insurers.
Quote:
Lori and T, do you become hardened to these things over time? Do you feel it is becoming harder to give consumers what they are entitled to? Maybe he is in the wrong line of work.
Dave, I write EVERY sheet the way I would repair my own car, every time. If I didn't I wouldn't be able to sleep nights, there is a way to keep your integrity and still do the job. I think those of us that worked in shops and then went to work for insurance carriers, have both an advantage and disadvantage. Is there bs in the job that I wish wasn't there? Well absolutely, but find a job that doesn't have it...People that work at McDonalds have stress and bs to put up with too, you have to figure out a way that you can always do the right thing in your own heart and mind and the job. If for instance the company I work for, would come out with some crazy rule that I HAD to follow and didn't agree with, couldn't get around well I have to go somewhere else that's all there is to it...


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 11:40 am   Post subject:   

Dave,



Quote:
I have three cars in my shop right now who's owners were told they would not pay for a tow unless it went to a Select Service shop.
These people need to contact your states DOI, IMMEDIATELY, they cannot say this, I'm really surprised that something like this was said, if all three would make complaints then something would be done...please try and encourage them to do so, otherwise nothing will ever change.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 2:33 pm   Post subject:   

Dave, I have had a Geico rep tell an 80 year old man that he had to drive his vehicle 20 miles up the interstate to their estimator at their preferred shop. This car's hood was in danger of flying open and the radiator was leaking. And he was a clamaint! The appraiser said if I have to drive 60 miles down the road to our shop, we expect you to drive your vehicle 20 miles to us. He claimed since they required all their insureds to use this preferred shop, the least this aged claimant could do was comply with his demand.



People in the collision business have countless stories like this every day. People that do not read or understand their policy, nor have a clue where to find their states unfair claims practices acts, revert back to a child like compliance to emboldened appraisers and adjusters that do know better. If you dare attempt to educate vehicle owners, insurers target your business with abandon and ramp up the steering language to keep vehicle owners from using your services.



They always say, they won't work from our estimates and you MAY have to pay more out of pocket at your shop which is not always true. Claimants in most states have remedies for underpaid claims such as appraisal and bad faith, that is unless you are from a state like Missouri that has allowed insurers to drop appraisal from the policy and basically challenge you to sue them.



I've decided to make it my goal to contact as many state representatives or to initiate a petition to require insurers to include appraisal in all Missouri auto policies.



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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 11:31 pm   Post subject:   

What you should be doing is having each and every one of these people file a complaint with the DOI...they HAVE to investigate them and the carriers HAVE to respond to them within a certain time frame...period...I don't know why you don't do this... Confused If you are in any hope to end what you consider a common practice, (which I question the commonality of it)...but if even one of these is true then that should be reported.



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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 12:07 am   Post subject:   

It's better to compile pattern and practice to eventually file TI cases. The DOI and Attorney general's office look the other way.



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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 12:52 am   Post subject:   

Well Mike, I gotta tell you I've worked for two large insurance carriers, and DOI complaints are taken very very seriously.



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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 1:39 am   Post subject:   

Quote:
So is your company, whether and employer or insurer, among the list at this link" http://www.justice.org/docs/TenWorstInsuranceCompanies.pdf
Do I think many insurance companies fail in some areas? Yup... as does any company, especially the larger ones. There was some information in their that was 100% correct... but much of it was 100% BS.



Consider the source of the information... they now call themselves, " American Association for Justice"... I guess injury attorneys or ambulance chasers just sounded a little to one sided. Tell you what... you don't accept insurance companies statements as fact on their own and I won't accept plaintiff attorney's either. They can call themselves whatever they want... who they are remains the same.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 1:45 am   Post subject:   

Quote:
Lori and T, do you become hardened to these things over time? Do you feel it is becoming harder to give consumers what they are entitled to? Maybe he is in the wrong line of work.
Good question and well put. Over the past 15 years or so I've worked for probably 9 companies. Many of them were non-standard carriers and were not the greatest companies (you can't be when you insure people who no one else will). But I've _never_ really had problems with an insurance company not paying for repairs or trying to get body shops to do anything they did not want to do. About the only thing close to that is an insurance company really putting a heavy hand on betterment/depreciation. But I must also say I've never worked for any of the largest insurance carriers (other then Hartford for a short time).
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 1:59 am   Post subject:   

Quote:
...Dave, I have had a Geico rep tell an 80 year old man that he had to drive his vehicle 20 miles up the interstate to their estimator at their preferred shop.
I've heard the similar things... that people have stated that I told them things _like_ this. It's a running joke that I have because I can spend 30 minutes on the phone with someone explaining everything in detail so that they know _exactly_ what is going on and then the following day they complain because no one has told them anything about what is happening (I'm not exaggerating at all). The joke is that I should just not tell them anything and stop wasting there and my time. Of course, I explain things because I think part of the problem on claims is that people just don't understand what is happening. So I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't. Smile



No offense to the 80 year old man but... did is it possible that this _80 year old_ man did not understand something or perhaps did not explain the condition of his vehicle very well? Example... if I told a person to drive their vehicle 20 miles and the owner knew the radiator fluid was leaking, how many owners would not know they can't drive the vehicle? How did this guy get it home after the accident if the fluid was leaking (I'm betting he drove it). Also, why motivation would the adjuster/appraiser have in getting the person to drive the vehicle as opposed to having it towed to the preferred shop? I don't know of any adjuster who is scared to pay $35 for a tow into one of their shops.



Oh, I also just told a shop and the owner of a vehicle that I needed to have them break out the frame labor hours instead of lumping paint and frame hours together. Granted, the shop did not speak much English but after I told the owner this simple thing 2 days in a row, he called his carrier and told them I was not going to pay for the frame labor (what ever the shop told me the frame labor was, I was going to just add it onto my appraisal). Sorry, I went on a little too long... but I'm just trying to show that miscommunication happens all the time.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 2:47 am   Post subject:   

The eighty year old man drove his car on the interstate with a leaking radiator and a potentially dangerous hood that could fly open because it would not latch all against my pleadings and warnings because he feared he would not get paid for his damage and did not file with his own company with whom he was contracted.



Too many people believe the addage of He that holds the gold has the power. I could not convince him that he had no duty to take his vehicle for an inspection with a company that he had no contract with. Elderly people live in fear of cancellation of their policies for not doing as their insurance companies command them to do even if the companies aren't theirs.



I will have to concede to you on the point that you made that insurers are poor communicators.



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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2008 5:05 am   Post subject: Probably a waste of time  

Lori, as you know, a lot of the steering is done by coached claims handlers telling half-truths. As far as things never changing, I think they are pretty rapidly. I have noticed a lot of my customers are not as trusting and are taking control. Some even say "just fix my car, I'll deal with the insurance company." I'm glad to hear that you follow the "golden rule." It just sickens me to see people taken advantage of. I know you guys see way too much of it here too. Mike, I have seen exactly that same one. I'll bet between the two of us, we could write pages of the different goofy things consumers have been told. Some are even funny, most are not. My customers always seem to understand that it's not about me.


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