by kleineigel » Tue Dec 02, 2008 05:14 pm
Can anyone offer the laws, regs or any guidance I may use use to settle our claim?
My only concern so far is Allstate requesting to remove the vehicle from the tow yard, I am willing to have it moved to a shop of my choice, but have not had time enough to find one. This happened over Thanksgiving, so the claim is still in it's early stages.
Thankfully, no one was injured, so this is purely property damage I'm dealing with. Our car was parked legally on the street in front of our house, hit head on. We are dealing with replacing the following:
'98 Mercury Grand Marquis LS model. Factory cd changer, leather seats, full size spare that matches alloy rim/tire. Car is in excellent condition, odometer is at 100,170 miles. We have a class 3 receiver hitch on the car to transport a wheelchair. Car is damaged on 3 sides, roof is buckled, Frame is severely bent in multiple points front and aft.
The adjuster has authorized a mini-van for my father in-law's wheelchair transport since they have been unable to locate a rental car with a hitch tube and wiring. No prior damage whatsoever.
I have been warned by several people that my son's car seat needs to be replaced, regardless of no visual damage. Is there any law or general rule I should refer to if they dissagree with that? We have already purchased similar model seat, same brand, just newer.
We keep our vehicles free of personal effects as much as possible, so I'm only dealing with the car seat, a small portable DVD player with broken screen, and a few damaged CD's/DVD's.
Our car was hit hard enough to send it into our yard, tearing up the grass, chipping the curb edge and leaning the utility pole our car was stopped against. The property belongs to friend's of ours, however we are documented legal property managers/renters for it. Not sure if we need to file a seperate claim for the lawn and curbing or not, or just hire the repairs and submit them when finished?..
Thank you for any guidance or suggestions on establishing value for our loss. I'm hoping to spend as little time as possible on this, but I don't want to end up with less than fair replacement value. The only motivating issue we have to get this behind us is our need for a vehicle to mount the wheelchair rack on to. I am a military servicemember facing a deployment in January, so I'm hoping to close it by then at the latest. Recommendations to help resolve it quickly would be appreciated as well.
My only concern so far is Allstate requesting to remove the vehicle from the tow yard, I am willing to have it moved to a shop of my choice, but have not had time enough to find one. This happened over Thanksgiving, so the claim is still in it's early stages.
Thankfully, no one was injured, so this is purely property damage I'm dealing with. Our car was parked legally on the street in front of our house, hit head on. We are dealing with replacing the following:
'98 Mercury Grand Marquis LS model. Factory cd changer, leather seats, full size spare that matches alloy rim/tire. Car is in excellent condition, odometer is at 100,170 miles. We have a class 3 receiver hitch on the car to transport a wheelchair. Car is damaged on 3 sides, roof is buckled, Frame is severely bent in multiple points front and aft.
The adjuster has authorized a mini-van for my father in-law's wheelchair transport since they have been unable to locate a rental car with a hitch tube and wiring. No prior damage whatsoever.
I have been warned by several people that my son's car seat needs to be replaced, regardless of no visual damage. Is there any law or general rule I should refer to if they dissagree with that? We have already purchased similar model seat, same brand, just newer.
We keep our vehicles free of personal effects as much as possible, so I'm only dealing with the car seat, a small portable DVD player with broken screen, and a few damaged CD's/DVD's.
Our car was hit hard enough to send it into our yard, tearing up the grass, chipping the curb edge and leaning the utility pole our car was stopped against. The property belongs to friend's of ours, however we are documented legal property managers/renters for it. Not sure if we need to file a seperate claim for the lawn and curbing or not, or just hire the repairs and submit them when finished?..
Thank you for any guidance or suggestions on establishing value for our loss. I'm hoping to spend as little time as possible on this, but I don't want to end up with less than fair replacement value. The only motivating issue we have to get this behind us is our need for a vehicle to mount the wheelchair rack on to. I am a military servicemember facing a deployment in January, so I'm hoping to close it by then at the latest. Recommendations to help resolve it quickly would be appreciated as well.
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2008 04:40 pm Post Subject:
I worked for a carrier once that would write an appraisal on all the unrelated damages on a total loss and deduct that from the value. This is _completely_ wrong for the reason's Fred mentions. The book values consider that an older vehicle is not going to be in as good of condition as a newer vehicle. The value listed already reflects certain minor damages such as door dings and the like. Granted, larger dents and accident damage should be deducted but even then, not at the repair cost!
Posted: Thu Dec 18, 2008 10:14 pm Post Subject:
We are insured through USAA, the liable party is Allstate.
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I contacted our insurance and told them to start a claim in case there were any issues with the other person's insurance coverage, lot's of uninsured drivers in this region, especially teenagers with unpaid premiums etc.
Our insurance policy only provides a compact car ($30.00 a day) for a rental, Allstate agreed to provide a mini-van ($41.50) to help us deal with the interim loss of a wheelchair rack. The rental car is being billed direct to Allstate.
Our car sat for a week with no action by Allstate at the tow yard, so I requested USAA take the car and start the appraisal and estimates. USAA made the offer above, Allstate has still failed to finish their appraisal to date.
Between the 2 of them, I would have hoped to be done with this by now, but now we're heading into Christmas with no final outcome still. I realize Allstate is going to protect their policy holder and keep things as low cost as possible, but I can't even get responses or consistent dialog with my own insurance.
If I was dealing with a straight business based insurance carrier, I might feel more expecting of this, but USAA prides themselves on taking care of military, they are afterall a servicemember's group. I'm quickly seeing the error in finding them any different than the next.
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Album is here for photos of car immediately after wreck and the following day in the tow yard.
http://www.PictureTrail.com/gid21201028
Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 11:49 am Post Subject:
Klien, I'm confused about what you are upset with your carrier about ? ..when did you ask them to proceed with your collision coverage? and they have made an 'offer' AND allowed you to stay in a rental? (should've been stopped a few days after the 'offer') please explain this 'time line again...i'm missing something here.
I looked at the pictures, and yep that puppy is a total FOR SURE...
I'm getting $6750.00 as a value, is the figure you've got from them less your deductible? Have you seen the actual evaluation sheet? (how they determined the value)? I 'might' have figured out the problem...a "GS" is valued at $5725.00...make sure that they have this right...you said your's was an ''LS"...also CCC print out should have a long list of the vehicles they are comparing it too...be sure and check that those are the exact same as yours...
An average 5 to 10 year old car will have a few parking lot door dings, paint chips on the front of the hood and bumper cover along with chipped and dull paint along the rocker panels. Also a little visible wear on the drivers seat and steering wheel.
Fred, you are absolutely correct...any PED (pre-exsisting damage) is 100% relavent to the yr/make/and model...as an example...will an inch long door ding without paint damage reduce the value on an 04 cavalier? nope...will the same door ding reduce the value on an 09 BMW? yep...it's all about common sense...will a vehicle of any age have a reduced value if the windshiled is cracked? yep...course I have to admit like in any profession there are some adjuster's without any...and simply write it all, because they think they are supposed to...which is totally incorrect...i don't even write wear and tear it has be glaring VALUE REDUCING damage..and these are fair deductions....I (we) value a vehicle based on NADA's ''clean retail" which is just that setting on the front line of a good used car lot ready to sell..as an example i'd say a good 80% of the vehicles i look at i'll add a detail to, now i don't add this if a wet rag, and a vacuum will clean up the car...only if a steam cleaning/stains are needed to be removed...again, (sady) most times it comes down to common sense..common sense dictates a vehicle that is a yr old will have a few flaws, and get more as time progresses..also the company I work for (and all should) have pre-set 'ranges' of this damage, now a current year and newer the PED would be taken at 100% then the next (let's say) 4 or 5 years the range is 80-90, next 5 is 60-80 and so on, i think 50% is the least...this also allows the settling rep to reduce this amount depending on what that damage is...another thing I don't write a ped estimate 'full bore'' meaning if it's a six hour dent i'll write three etc.Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2008 05:09 pm Post Subject:
Lori,
First off, I feel I need to thank you for your responses and the information you have included in them. I am truely grateful to have someone as a 3rd party to bounce concerns off of.
Timeline:
Thanksgiving night, car was wrecked and towed away.
I contacted our insurance Friday morning and started a claim, they did not give me any response back until 430pm with the offer of a rental car and assurances our car would be evaluated by Monday evening at the latest.
Allstate contacted us on their own Friday afternoon to notify us they were accepting full liability. We informed them we needed a wheelchair accessible vehicle from them, alas the mini-van I've mentioned.
The following Thursday, our vehicle was still not recovered by either USAA or Allstate from, the tow yard. I called them to check on status and neither had started anything on the claim besides a claim # and initial report. USAA took possesion of the car on Friday evening (7 days after the wreck) and transported it to one of their preferred shops.
Nearly 2 weeks have passed since then, I received the first settlement offer from USAA this past Tuesday (dec 15th date on header) by written email.
I was expecting minor wear and tear to be part of the depreciated NADA listing, that's why I am concerned with the nit pick write-ups the adjuster listed down on the car's report. The car is garage kept primarily, no food or drinks besides water are allowed in our vehicles.
I am attempting to attach the report to this post, but it looks like I'll need to upload it to the site I have the pics on after converting them to images. I can't get the word document to upload directly.
Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 01:10 am Post Subject:
I was expecting minor wear and tear to be part of the depreciated NADA listing, that's why I am concerned with the nit pick write-ups the adjuster listed down on the car's report.
I'd be interested to see this report, and what these nit picking things are! Also you still have an 'ace' in that you haven't received an offer from allstate yet, 3rd party claims are 'typcially' a little more free with the dough! :wink: (no contract)...so that's still an option, have you called your allstate adjuster lately to what the hold up and what their offer of total loss is? As USAA told you when you have to return the rental car?Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 03:16 am Post Subject:
Okay, this took a bit to get uploaded, hopefully the print is big enough to read for you.
http://www.PictureTrail.com/gid21208246
If the site prompts for you for a password to view this album, type in the word: wreck
I've edited out most of the personal info, but I'm still a little gun shy of public access beyond this thread's readers, which are probably numerous as it is.
USAA told us that since they have made an settlement offer, Allstate was giving us 3 days from that point on for the rental car. I have not heard from Allstate, the adjuster has not returned my calls all day today, her fellow co-workers will not offer any information on the claim. 2 said she was there today, but talking on the other line.
Thankfully, I had a chance to speak with my squadron's JAG officer this afternoon (military attorney), he can not act on my behalf, but he can consult with me and advise me of my rights. (He did provide me with some advice to what you have said so far, similar responses as well). Free consultation and courtesy referrals are the best part of his help.
Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 04:10 am Post Subject:
Pages 2 : Breaks down the payment amounts. I don't see any deduction for prior damage. I do see a $81 increase due to the good condition of your vehicles interior. They only additional items they added were for power passenger seat and leather seats.
Page 12/13: Shows you 3 of the most closely related vehicles that were used in the comparison. The adjusted for differences in these vehicles in order to make their values comparable to your vehicle. The offer is about an average of these adjusted values.
As you can see, page 12 shows your vehicle to have a AM/FM/Tape stereo. From your post, this is obviously incorrect. This is why I _always_ tell people to review the valuation to make sure that the options are correct. Also, I see no allowance for the hitch.
If you want to press the issue with Allstate, fax them a letter stating that they should not be cutting off the rental until they make a reasonable/fair settlement offer... which that have yet to do. If USAA has called them and Allstate told them the cut off date for the rental I'm betting that Allstate is under the impression that you are filing the claim with USAA. You need to determine who you are going to file the claim with and if you still need to hear from Allstate to decide, you need to let them know this asap!
Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 04:37 am Post Subject:
I was informed by the adjuster that they reduced the value based on the oil leaks of the engine, dirt in the engine compartment, and cracked/worn seats. I realize what it says in the report, which is why I'm getting upset with this.
I've already notified Allstate I wanted the rental car to be reinstated until they provide me a settlement amount. They are not returning my calls or messages, I have been polite up until this point, Monday is going to be a little different now that I've got some recommendations from our JAG officer to follow through with.
Posted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 12:48 pm Post Subject:
I was informed by the adjuster that they reduced the value based on the oil leaks of the engine, dirt in the engine compartment, and cracked/worn seats. I realize what it says in the report, which is why I'm getting upset with this.
It appears they rated your vehicle ''good'' which believe me is a rarety :roll: 'fair' or less than is the norm...maybe what they are saying is because of this they rated you fair instead of excellent? I don't know...If I were you. I'd tell my carrier that I've thought it over and for now I'm going to go with Allstate and let them pay the claim...what are they going to do if you come back and say, 'hey changed my mind again, slap that (whatever the acv was) on me?" they might be alittle pissed, but who cares they can't do anything about it...it's a roll of the dice if allstate uses ccc might get the exact same amount...but as yet you have no offer from allstate, i (personally) would be playing both sides of this fence and take the higher offer...Here's the deal with ccc and products like theirs opposed to say NADA , Edmunds etc...NADA tells me $6625.00 for your car...and that's probably high...ccc and 'live' time programs like theirs are 'on top of the market' where nada and others are not...ccc bases their figures on ACTUAL vehicle...well what happen to the market on big gas hawgs in the last year? yep, down the pipe...ccc recognizes this immediately in their data the other programs do not adjust theirs so radically...in other words they are alittle behind, and are almost always higher...
If you want you can call those two comparatives, and talk with the sellers...there is a big gap between the two vehicles. you might want to call the low end one and see about prior damage etc..which of course yours does not have.
In the mean while as I said I would let allstate do their job and provide an offer, their selves you might want to tell them you don't want them using USAA's they need to independently evaluate the vehicle...(they should have to anyway)...and when can you expect an offer, and you will stay in the rental untill then right?
Call your adjuster monday, when you get someone else of a v/m hit zero and ask to talk to that adjusters boss, or the branch manager, and don't hang up till you do...
Posted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 09:56 pm Post Subject:
Lori,
Your suggestions helped greatly. After 1.5 hours on the line with Allstate, their claims manager came back with a settlement amount of $6,840.00 with additional allowances for the receiver hitch. Total loss settlement totals up to $7,156.18 with USAA still covering the personal contents for another $417.-- . Refusing to accept a call back or voicemail appears to be something that their office was not used to dealing with. Once the claims manager was aware of the things I pointed out, it became a priority to him to close out the claim immediately. Whether he felt obligated to do right or just didn't want to hear from me again is irrelevant, Wednesday I meet with a drive-thru adjuster to exchange the title for their settlement check.
I am left with alot of doubts for continuing coverage with USAA after this. Whether I am a 3rd party to another person's liability claim or not, I still expect more from my own underwriter than weeks with no resolve and a settlement offer differential of nearly $2,000.00 lower than the other person's carrier. USAA's only response was "take it, they are obviously making a mistakein your favor".
I'm sure I could negotiate further with it, but in reality, the time wasted already is just not worth more aggravation.
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