What is owed and what is wanted can be two different things.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 4:22 pm   Post subject:   

Ummmm, If it wasn't damaged... Why was it Re-manufactured?? Instead of just paint it and bolt it on the car.



Speaking of Used... with the proliferation of A.M. parts through the constant push by insurers, its very likely that Used Part won't be "Used OEM". There is a good chance it will be... "Used A.M".



I don't want Used A.M. parts on my new car. Do you want them on your new car??



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PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 4:37 pm   Post subject:   

The parts are usually labeled as remanufactured as a classification. IMHO it's more like refurbished parts... the company makes sure they are the same specs as new. Most of the time these will be parts like bumpers, which don't have any structural damage but may need to be re-chromed or a radiator that needs to be recorded.

Quote:
Speaking of Used... with the proliferation of A.M. parts through the constant push by insurers, its very likely that Used Part won't be "Used OEM". There is a good chance it will be... "Used A.M".
Nope. AM are labeled as AM. I've used _plenty_ of used parts and _never_ used an AM part. Two different thing and two completely different labels.
Quote:
I don't want Used A.M. parts on my new car. Do you want them on your new car??
Really not the issue. What is owed and what is wanted can be two different things. If the person wants better then what they had, they can pay the difference.



But if you read this entire thread (I think it's all in this one), you'd see that there are _many_ claims being made for how bad AM parts are but 99% of it is speculation, assumptions and plain incorrect.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 6:53 pm   Post subject:   

Many salvage and recycling companies are quoting used front end assemblies and when they arrive, it turns out they have used aftermarket parts to build a used assembly from a mixture of used and new a/m parts.



Many installers remove the labels that are required to be present on a/m parts or they simply paint over them. There are some salvage yards that quote used parts specified by an insurer estimate. They often times show up as previously installed a/m parts.



I am sure this is what FK is referring to. It's a credibility issue that is being questioned by FK regarding the supplier of the used parts not knowing the difference of used oem or used a/m parts.



Much of our used and salvaged vehicles are being purchased from buyers across our borders and across the oceans. Wonder why they would have an interest in our used parts when they have access to their own a/m parts? Those outside the usa are bidding higher on salvage cars for parts and rebuilding of total losses which is raising the prices of LKQ or used parts. Somebody is makin some lucrative money on total losses to be rebuilt overseas instead of being junked as they should be for quality used parts if there is such a thing.



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PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:58 pm   Post subject:   

tcope,



Quote:
The parts are usually labeled as remanufactured as a classification. IMHO it's more like refurbished parts...




Come on, surely your not implying that a supplier would Re-core a radiator just to brighten and freshen it up??



That reads like someone is teetering on the edge of Fraud. remanufactured & refurbished are not the same thing



Quote:
the company makes sure they are the same specs as new...




I'm curious... where & how do these Remanufacturing Refurbisher's get their hands on the OE's internal specifications?? And for so many different makes, models, and model years???



Have you ever personally observed how these companies implement and execute their Quality Control. Do you even know if they have Quality Controls in place?



Quote:
Most of the time these will be parts like bumpers, which don't have any structural damage




By saying most of the time they don't have structural damage you are admitting they at least sometimes have damage. Which by the way, contradicts your earlier statement.



To paraphrase:



What I see is that there are _many_ claims being made for how good A.M. & Remanufactured parts are but 99% of it is speculation, assumptions and plain incorrect. And I'm speaking as someone who actually repairs cars.





Quote:
Nope. AM are labeled as AM. I've used _plenty_ of used parts and _never_ used an AM part. Two different thing and two completely different labels.




I'm not talking about "Labels", I'm talking about an actual Junk Yard part that is from a car that had previously been repaired with A.M. parts. And now that used A.M. part will be re-used on another car. AKA "used A.M.". In this case a "Used AM part" would not be equal to a used OE part allowing the car owner to reject its use on their car.





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PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 10:36 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
Come on, surely your not implying that a supplier would Re-core a radiator just to brighten and freshen it up??
I'm not sure what I'm implying as I'm not even sure what I said. Laughing . I probably never should have commented as much of this is outside of my expertize. So, I apologize. I should not have mentioned radiators. As remanufactured has been explained to me, it's a used part brought up the specs of a new part.



I don't know if I can comment on reconditioned parts containing AM parts. I personally use very few salvage parts and when I do, it's things like bumper covers, perhaps a fender and some other minor items. With what I know, I don't see how these things could contain AM parts. I can certainly see something like a clip containing AM parts but I'd not use something like that and in 20 some years, I could count on one hand the number of times I've seen something like that used.



Please enlighten me... in what type of cases do you see reconditioned parts containing AM parts?

Quote:
By saying most of the time they don't have structural damage you are admitting they at least sometimes have damage. Which by the way, contradicts your earlier statement.
That is not what I said. I said, "Most of the time these will be parts like bumpers, which don't have any structural damage". "Most of the time" applies to the type of part.... not to structural damage".
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 2:21 am   Post subject:   

The only thing I would be leary of is after market chrome, especially on the bumpers, my uncle had one put on his toyota pick up, it looked great at first then about a year later, it was solid rust and was not under any type of warranty. So I would see what type of warranty comes with them, especially with the chrome

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 3:11 am   Post subject:   

can you not get your warranty holder involved here, I mean since your vehicle is still under warranty and they will be paying for any problems, shouldn't they have something to say about the parts that go on the vehicle, especially since they have the potential of replacing them at some poing.



call them first and have them contact Geico about your obligation under your warrenty.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 10:32 pm   Post subject:   

Never thought of that idea. Maybe putting aftermarket parts may somehow void the warrenty.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 1:48 pm   Post subject:   

.

.

.



Quote:
goodnatured Posted: 09 Jan 2009 02:21



---------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------



The only thing I would be leary of is after market chrome, especially on the bumpers, my uncle had one put on his toyota pick up, it looked great at first then about a year later, it was solid rust and was not under any type of warranty. So I would see what type of warranty comes with them, especially with the chrome




goodnatured, was this bumper something your uncle did on his own or was it part of an Insurance Co. recommended repair?



Quote:
goodnatured Posted: 09 Jan 2009 03:11



---------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------



can you not get your warranty holder involved here, I mean since your vehicle is still under warranty and they will be paying for any problems, shouldn't they have something to say about the parts that go on the vehicle, especially since they have the potential of replacing them at some poing.



call them first and have them contact Geico about your obligation under your warrenty.




NO... Toyota won't warranty After-Market parts, nor should they or any other Automobile Manufacturer. That would be like you & your spouse building and selling Pick-Nick tables with a 5 year guarantee and then warranting a table someone else made. Not gonna happen is it.



If this bumper was part of an Insurance Co. recommended repair part... they may owe the cost of replacing it. Many [likely most] insurer's that are pushing A.M. parts onto consumers automobiles _claim_ these parts are 'L'ike 'K'ind & 'Q'uality. And... to encourage acceptance of these parts they claim to offer a Lifetime, as long as you own the car *warranty* on the A.M. parts used in the repair of an automobile.



So... if this was insurer specified, get on the phone and make em pay whatever it costs to make it right.



Quote:
fireyone Posted: 09 Jan 2009 22:32



---------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------



Never thought of that idea. Maybe putting aftermarket parts may somehow void the warrenty.




It won't Void the entire warranty on your new car [like some dealers imply], but the New car manufacturer shouldn't warranty parts they did not make or install on your automobile.



One other point. if the rust from that rusty A.M. part spread onto other OE parts of you automobile the warranty on the additional parts would not be covered by the automobile manufacturer.





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PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 2:24 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
Speaking of ReManufactured.... Isn't that some used, damaged part that wasn't good enough for someone else
It is a used part that is/has been repaired (i know you know this) same as a reman starter, rack, whatever....if a mustang is totaled, hit in the front end, rear cover, has a couple of scratches or gouges, it can be pulled sent to a reman company and repaired, and primed and sent to the shop...I've remaned, the covers that are on the vehicle (damaged) many times, when I cannot find one, or the parts delay is forever.....I have rarely ever had an issue with a reman part....


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 2:31 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
Many salvage and recycling companies are quoting used front end assemblies and when they arrive, it turns out they have used aftermarket parts to build a used assembly from a mixture of used and new a/m parts.
I bid used parts everyday Mike (not used front's daily and frankly usually avoid them if possible, as by the time, you add all the not included operations it's less expensive to part it)...at any rate, I've have yet to have a shop tell me they have received a used a/m part, rather than a used oem part...now this could be the yards I'm using, could be some (duh) some crap yards out there doing this...but the ones I use do not, and if they did first of all the shop would reject the part, and call me immediately, then I would in turn, rip someone a new one...and that would be then end of that tune....if a used oem part is bid, then that is what damn well better show up....if I wanted to bid an a/m that is what I would've bid to begin with...this is 'yard' problem, not an insurance, nor a shop issue...personally I wouldn't do buisness with a yard, that allowed this to happen more than once... Mad



Quote:
and in 20 some years, I could count on one hand the number of times I've seen something like that used.
In more than 20 years I've never seen it and I source used parts a lot! again...maybe the yards we're using Confused


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 3:15 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
I bid used parts everyday Mike (not used front's daily and frankly usually avoid them if possible, as by the time, you add all the not included operations it's less expensive to part it)...at any rate, I've have yet to have a shop tell me they have received a used a/m part, rather than a used oem part...now this could be the yards I'm using, could be some (duh) some crap yards out there doing this...but the ones I use do not, and if they did first of all the shop would reject the part, and call me immediately, then I would in turn, rip someone a new one...and that would be then end of that tune....if a used oem part is bid, then that is what damn well better show up....if I wanted to bid an a/m that is what I would've bid to begin with...this is 'yard' problem, not an insurance, nor a shop issue...personally I wouldn't do buisness with a yard, that allowed this to happen more than once...




Lets cut right to the chase... unless you personally inspect every part that *your* yards sell... there is no way you could know they have *never* sold a used A.M part to any of *your* body shops. Or that *your* body shops would notice. And if *your* body shops use a lot of Used parts and say they have never received a Used AM part.... maybe they should look a little closer in the future.



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PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 3:40 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
New car manufacturer shouldn't warranty parts they did not make or install on your automobile
They also won't warrant brand new oem parts put on your vehicle either UNLESS THEIR body shop does the work... Rolling Eyes


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 6:41 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
Lets cut right to the chase... unless you personally inspect every part that *your* yards sell... there is no way you could know they have *never* sold a used A.M part to any of *your* body shops. Or that *your* body shops would notice. And if *your* body shops use a lot of Used parts and say they have never received a Used AM part.... maybe they should look a little closer in the future.
So I guess it's at least as "likely" that there were no AM parts being used. You can specilate all you want.



But I think it's _more_ likely that at some point over the course of 20 years and thousands of used parts that _some_ body shop would have noticed an AM part. I guess if they all can't tell the difference, they must be pretty good! Wink
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 6:50 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
Lets cut right to the chase... unless you personally inspect every part that *your* yards sell... there is no way you could know they have *never* sold a used A.M part to any of *your* body shops. Or that *your* body shops would notice. And if *your* body shops use a lot of Used parts and say they have never received a Used AM part.... maybe they should look a little closer in the future.
First of all Fred, what's with the ''*" you and your sarcasim? I don't own any shops or yards, I work exclusively (for right now-for the most part anyway Rolling Eyes ) in seven shops that are ''preferred' shops because that's my job...(which is by the way changing drastically in a month or two, something that will flat thrill the pants off the 'preferred' shop haters Wink )...



anyway....I do personally inspect ANY and ALL used or a/m parts that come to any shop that I wrote an estimate of repair to if there is ANY problem with said part...period....(unless of course I'm on vacation/sick whatever)...
Quote:
Or that *your* body shops would notice
I assure you Fred, that your's and Mike's shops are not the ONLY shops in this mighty country that do a quality job...and 'know their stuff'....and really why are you being insulting to another shop(s) that *YOU* know absolutely nothing about? I don't get this Fred...where are you coming from on this attack, it's not like you... Confused
Quote:
And if *your* body shops use a lot of Used parts and say they have never received a Used AM part.... maybe they should look a little closer in the future
I wouldn't think they use any more than any other shop does...Your implication that '*my*' shops (which frankly is just habit, and I assure you they would not be offended as I say this to them as well...because 'my' shops are IMO the absolute top of the line shops in their given areas, re: repair qualilty)....have neither the skill set nor inclination to throughly inspect parts received prior to using them in a repair....in fact three out of the seven have specific 'parts' guys whos sole job is to order, receive, INSPECT, and deliver the parts to the correct job...



I'm not for one minute saying that I have never had an issue with a part, used, a/m and new oem...what I am saying is that I have never had one of 'my' shops advise me that they have received an a/m used part...in the place of an oem used part...now, have they had this happen and then called the vendor who quickly rectified the situation? possible, but highly unlikely because they would most certainly want to make me aware of it...(you know shops love complaining about parts Fred... Wink )...I was off all last week, but I will next week ask each of them out of curiosity...and will certainly let the thread know.



Just to set the record straight...I do not have ''my'' yards, I am required to contact a certain number based on the vehicle, part etc....do I have 'my' (not to be confused with 'company') favorites ? sure I do, the ones that don't screw the repair up...I'm sure you do too...Are 'my' shops required to use the vendors I source? nope they are not...they are free to use whomever they wish...you and I both know that parts price negotiation is no art at all...if yard 'a' has a door for 400 bucks, and yard 'b' has one for 500...yard 'b' will ''miraculously' lower their price to meet or beat that 400 as well...as to a/m I don't know about your area, but in mine, I'd say a good 70% are being price matched by the OEM vendor....amazing ain't it? Rolling EyesRolling Eyes 'somebody' has been making a ton of money for years and years off their parts, (from shops and carriers alike, surely THAT we can agree on)....



One other thing, I don't pretend to have any idea whatsoever what the parts situation is in PA, I haven't a clue...NW MO and the bordering states I handle, yep....I know quite a little bit about....could be you have a totally different animal in your neck of the woods fred, I don't know.



So Fred "Lets cut right to the chase" ....... who put a burr under your saddle with me? ConfusedWink


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