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PostPosted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 4:17 am   Post subject:   

You sir are an insolent git.



I did not express nor imply a thing. I gave the definition as it appears in the dictionary. You may want to call Medicare and get those glasses swapped out for a newer, stronger prescription. Or set you font to large in Internet Explorer. But neither of those will assist you it comprehending a 1st grade statement as simple as “according to urbandictionary .com negatism is Retarded way of saying negativity.”



Now go potty before you get in bed . Your sister/wife doesnt like to change the sheets every morning because you cant hold your water. 1 more time and it is the night time depends for you.



I will save you the trouble of looking it up



Insolent =impudent: marked by casual disrespect; a flip answer to serious question.

Git =A completely ignorant, childish person with no manners. A person who feels justified in their callow behaviour. a person that is useless, troublesome or annoying, a fool.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 10:40 am   Post subject:   

Quote:
Lori, never mis spells right?
nope lori misspells all the time...just not generally when on the rare occasion (mike) i'm trying to insult someone...
Quote:
More disinformation from Lori,
No misinformation I assure you, I however do not copy peoples private messages to me and post them for the public...not to mention the added embarrassment to you dear, although I have to admit, that isn't my primary motive. In not betraying a confidence...
Quote:
Stands for Not a bad older broad A older woman who still looks good.

I think Mike likes you
Oh Rick I needed that! LaughingLaughingLaughing You did make me spit the coffee that time ! LaughingLaughing



The feeling is mutual Mike, I don't hate anyone...a word I don't use...You and I both use sarcasim alot and effectively I think....I disagree with a lot you say, but at the end of the day, I have no hard feelings for you...some of the things (two) that you have said more than crossed the line and were both out and out lies and mean spirited, and totally meant to

misinform, but again, that's your style of debate...but dude I mean it when I say if I'm in Joplin, don't be surprised to see me pull up....btw, I like Ricks definition better...and seriously never heard of it...remember Agnew well, but do not remember that word at all...
Quote:
Do I 100% agree with every word Lori writes? No. Do I trust most of the information she provides? Yes. Do I appreciate her help? 100% yes.
Thanks Rick, and all debates aside, there are several of us that post here regularly a few are adjusters...we have no side line jobs that we are premoting, nothing to gain by posting (I don't get paid to moderate) and truly the only motivation is to try in some small way to help people get thru the mud that is insurance, (for me) claims in particular, most people are over whelmed over stressed, and distrusting when they have a claim...it makes zero impact on me how a claim is settled, but a huge impact if I think that I have helped take just the smallest load off of someone else. By giving them information that I just happen to know quite a bit about....



You're figuring Mike out pretty quick...unfortunately, sorry...


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 3:04 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
that you have said more than crossed the line and were both out and out lies and mean spirited, and totally meant to

misinform, but again, that's your style of debate...




I believe that if you feel I have crossed the line, you certainly have to look in the mirror and at your posts lori.





Rick

Quote:
I did not express nor imply a thing.




Quote:
Retarded way of saying negativity




I believe you referenced my spelling as a retarded way, could only be understood to mean that a retard (your word) would spell that way.

Just don't understand how you feel you can belittle people with birth defects by using retard as a slur and not believe you have crossed a line.



Got any ethnic slurs or more redneck references you'd like to get out of your system or regional remarks? I only sarcastically referenced your youth and naivety with the reference "wet behind the ears" and "still in diapers" merely place you chronologically at the time of the phrase in question. When you have been in either the insurance industry or the collision industry for more than twenty years, you may have something relevent to add to my rebuttals to Lori. You sir, unleashed the barage of slurs. You sir, are the insolent one. If you want to show Lori you're a groupie simply send her a pm. She's proven she's a big girl with her own ability to unleash untruths and personal attacks, I doubt she needs your help.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 8:54 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
I believe that if you feel I have crossed the line, you certainly have to look in the mirror and at your posts lori.


Mike I have never said anything even remotely close as you have when you said that all adjusters get bonus' for underpaying claims, that is just one of them........



Rick don't pay any mind to Mike, when he says things, they are merely "only sarcastically referring" to things...When another does it, it is , "ethnic slurs", or, "redneck references" etc...the world comes to an end....he refuses to look at himself clearly.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 11:18 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
I believe you referenced my spelling as a retarded way


Once again you dont get it. It is the definition FROM THE DICTIONARY NOT MY WORDS OR EXPRESSIONS.

You only assumed I was wet behind the ears and still in diapers when that quote was made, when in fact I was in San Diego.

Seems to me you like to dish it out but cant take it.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 11:59 pm   Post subject:   

Hey hey I didn't know there was drama on these boards. I thought everyone here was just one big happy family. Oh well, everything needs a little spice now and then.



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PostPosted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 12:49 am   Post subject:   

Rick, the only thing for which I am sorry, is the inability of you being able to see your culpability in this misunderstanding and Lori' dilusions that she never is guilty of the very things she claims I am.



Asking some insurers for help in your particular situation is a lot like asking your hangman if he needs to borrow your rope.



If you want to know or understand your thirdparty or legal rights go to a consumer friendly site that points out some insurance abuse. If you need someone to help you calculate your acv, Lori's your gal.



If you try to help posters with information based on past relationships and experiences as a repair professional, some insurance claims people simply attack your posts, and start calling you a liar.



Sorry for having a callous hide. If you post here long enough you develope one or they eat you for lunch. I originally mistook you for a claims person, my mistake. Repair professionals are out numbered here and we have to defend our positions when we point out insurance abuse.



Under different circumstances, I could have given you the names of people in the Dallas area that could have saved you a lot of grief with how your claim was handled and possibly expedited your claim settlement.



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PostPosted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:44 am   Post subject:   

Quote:
Under different circumstances, I could have given you the names of people in the Dallas area that could have saved you a lot of grief with how your claim was handled and possibly expedited your claim settlement.
And charged you a pretty penney to get that help...Rick's an intelligent guy, he knows how to google...He knows it's free here, and is fully capable of making informed intelligent decisions...I've nothing to gain by giving him or anyone else the benefit of my years of experience...Let's not forget Mike, I've been at this over twenty years myself. Also was a facility manager for a large shop, for several years, and still work in body shops all day every day. I have zero issue with collision repair owners, managers, or techs, and some of my closest friends are in those groups...Body shops are my bread and butter, I work with them daily and have for more years than I can to count...I doubt you could find one in a hundred mile sweep that would say a bad word about me....You will be hard pressed to find any threads other than ones that Mike is professing his opinions (mostly) as gospel that I've taken harsh issue with...huge difference between Mike, and the 'industry' he claims to represent. He posts regularly on a board that boasts all of about ten posters...that are insurance haters...they attack and eat their own, if they disagree...(those aren't just my words)...so Mike, 'natter' on.....


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 9:45 am   Post subject:   

Quote:
Hey hey I didn't know there was drama on these boards. I thought everyone here was just one big happy family
It is for the most part...Mike just drops in to bring out this side of me... Rolling Eyes


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 3:46 pm   Post subject:   

Here is a simple explanation, which will be rebutted, distorted, and labeled as fabrication and lies in short time by one poster and perhaps two.





The side that I bring out of some claims people is the side that too many people see in their claims experience with some insurance company representatives. I am simply passionate about my collision industry independence and some claims people are loyal to the company line to the point of defending the indefensible which is incomplete indemnification and refusing to pay for all procedures which are recommended by the vehicle manufacturer which if not performed could compromise the vehicle owners safety foremost and value of their vehicle leastly.



The insurance industry pays huge sums of money for companies like J.D. Powers to study them to help them understand how to best help policy holders and to retain them. Not treating vehicle owners like crap would be a start and letting real professionals determine costs of repair instead of a kid running around in an suv with no collision training experience telling a professional how to repair a car. Paying your claims in full and not witholding full indemnification would be another. Not telling vehicle owners that they must use the insurance preferred shop and that their shop can not be trusted would be another recommendation.



The forum that the poster mentions that I participate in, is comprised of like minded passionate industry people that have not sold their souls to the insurance industry for the promise of referrals and becoming direct reapair partners only to be thrown under the bus later and to possibly compromise vehicle safety and value. The sage and knowledgeable passionate posters at that forum take a very dim view of those that attempt to post or argue with horse hockey for ammunition. BS is easily sniffed out and those posters are invited to continue but to leave the propaganda at the door. Those posters over there that people refer to are some of the most passionate consumer protective shop owners in the country and would not hesitate to give a knowledgeable hand to a vehicle owners inquirey. I am speaking of the shop owner discussion board and not the consumer board that has been decimated by people that do not want vehicle owners to receive help apparently.



Many of those same posters believed the insurance mantra that they wanted to help the collision industry,and be partners with them, but saw through the cloak of lies before they signed agreements with insurers that compromised the vehicle owners. A repair shop owner should be the vehicle owner's advocate for proper repairs; not a co-conspirator in depriving or defrauding the vehicle owner of what is due them under the law or contract that the shop is not a party to. I know of no contributing posters there that would agree to clip a car or take half of a car to repair your car and create a frankensteinmobile. Make no mistake about it, insurers own many shops without their names being on the documents of ownership. When an appraiser or poster refers to a shop or group of shops as their shops, you can tell they work for the insurer and not the vehicle owner. Huge difference.



The people that I would have put a poster in touch with would have cost the poster no expense and they only had everything to gain including time and money. Some shop owners recognize that this is still their industry and refuse to abdicate it to the insurance industry. They subjucate shops and compromise their ability to repair based on knowledge and experience, but instead insist on repairs based on databases that they have a fair amount of control and pursuasion over. This is why you see such charged attacks and allegations of lies against anyone who challenges the status quo and stands up for the vehicle owners and themselves.



Having worked in a bodyshop in admnistrative employment makes insurance appraisers no more an expert at collision repair than I would be considered a doctor because I work in the cafeteria as a server. Who would you rather trust your family's safety with? A trained doctor , a trained repair expert, or someone who is looking to pay for the cheapest and quickest repairs that could compromise vehicle and family safety. Appraisers do not make the rules, they simply follow beancounters recommendations that are designed to keep more of the policyholders indemnification in the stockholders pockets at the vehicle owner's expense.



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PostPosted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 7:08 pm   Post subject: Take another look Lori  

Pick a company who you think "pushes the envelope" as Tcope says, and know that with the direction that things are going you will most likely be faced with management that will tell you to "do what they do or hit the road." Maybe that has already happened. You can't tell me that some of the horror stories that people post here don't have you shaking your head in disgust. Regular posters on Pro-d, like the Piersons, have just collected documents to be used as tools to try to help shops and consumers. It's not to different from some of the things that I see you guys doing here. They and others are not making this stuff up, they are just the messengers. JMT Dave


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 10, 2008 12:12 am   Post subject:   

Dave, I just looked at a collision repair from a large metropolitan area in my state performed by a first party insurance company preferred shop. The vehicle owner's own insurer suggested the shop as one of their best. They decided to go first party because the cooperation from the negligent party was non existent. Had to investigate, no rental til they decided to take responsibility for the claim even though it was witnessed by a policeman.



There is potential fraud involved on first party. The vehicle owner or insurance partner was billed for complete replacement of a structural panel but it was poorly sectioned and covered with undercoat. Really bad welds and unprotected welds with no corrosion treatment. There were some reconditioned parts placed on a 30,000 dollar 2008 vehicle with less than 5000 miles on it.



Looks like the shop may have to buy this car back before the vehicle owner can even claim DV against the negligent party so the shop can stay on the program of the best of the best repair shops in the area. I am sure this shop had to sign one of those silly agreements where they promised they would repair according the insurance partner's parameters rather than the manufacturer and to hold the insurer harmless for that. Rolling Eyes



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 10, 2008 9:56 am   Post subject:   

Golly I just don't know where to start Confused .



First, are there crappy companys, adjusters AND body shops out there? Yep, sure are and I've dealt with all of them...I have just as many horror story's as you do Mike, about horrific repairs done to vehicles....This isn't the carrier's fault this is the tech in the booth and his bosses fault...if you are going to blame an entire industry and say that all crappy repairs are a by-product of drp's then what was your excuse for crappy repairs years ago before any drp's? Don't say there weren't just as many because there were! I saw them too!



Dave, I've never been told that I have to do something that I couldn't live with, if I were I'd quit....I write every single sheet the exact way I'd fixed my own vehicle....



Again are there some bad company's yep, bad adjuster's yep, bad shop owners yep, bad crack head techs? yep...so what? I wish there wasn't but there are....same with bad doctors, lawyers, and servers in resturants....we all have crap in our own 'industry's ' that need cleaning up...to blame another industry for the crap in our own back yard, is not taking responsiblity for ourselves and attempting to better our lot rather than like a brat of a kid, blame everyone else but those who actually commit the 'sin' against our industry that you claim such passion for....instead you throw retoric that is non-sense...I've asked you this before Mike, what EXACTLY other than babbling have you done?



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PostPosted: Sun Aug 10, 2008 4:31 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
The vehicle owner or insurance partner was billed for complete replacement of a structural panel but it was poorly sectioned and covered with undercoat. Really bad welds and unprotected welds with no corrosion treatment.




Sectioning whether performed by a DRP or independant shop is delicate and controversial repair method. Almost as controversial as clipping. Sectioning information from the vehicle manufacturers is not easily obtainable and oftentimes does not exist. Sectioning makes the sectioned piece either too strong or weaker than it was before. As far as I know crash testing has not been done on this procedure. Hopefully this procedure will eventually go away as the OEM's are beginning to sell ony complete unisides with no guidelines for sectioning rockers, pillars, quarters etc. The estimating programs still provide a sectioning time though. Complete uniside replacement is the only safe way to go as a rocker section repacement cut in at the wrong place and installed in a poor workmanship like manner could be disastrous in the event of a subsequent collision. This procedure appears to be quietly going away. I hope so.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 10, 2008 6:00 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
that all crappy repairs are a by-product of drp's then what was your excuse for crappy repairs years ago before any drp's? Don't say there weren't just as many because there were! I saw them too!




You can say there have not alway been drps, but there have always been repairs that went directly to the corrupt shops that greased the palms of dirty appraisers. They just decided to make it more formal by creating drp programs.



Maybe the beancounters weren't getting their share, so they decided to make if more formal with contracts. This is where you are required to grease the palm metaphorically, or such as money in envelopes as mister groebner of illinois received to ensure shops remained on preferred lists, or simply agreed to concessions of working cheaper and faster,and passing along parts and labor discounts, promising to use imitation parts when available, and no fees for processing total losses; these being a few of the free services to belong to the partner's club.



These factors have led to slave shops having to maintain good grades with their partners, working faster which leads to cutting corners (sectioning or not doing what you were paid to do), Why do shops that continue to defraud consumers and their partners remain on those programs? Insurers are stuck with a system they created to maximize their profits and to CONTROL their perceived bleeding of profits



Quote:
instead you throw retoric that is non-sense...I've asked you this before Mike, what EXACTLY other than babbling have you done?




I am one of many collision repair people who are not afraid to expose the flaws in my own industy's desire to partner with insurers because they are too lazy to do their own marketing and developing their own clientel. I am not afraid to expose poor quality repairs and fraud that get rewarded because of cost savings to insurers. I do not live in fear of losing work because I don't go along to get along. I do not have to pay money for or buy my customers.



Too many shops find it easier to grease the palm or pay the pimp. Members in our industry and Attorney Ms Eversmen are developing a Code of Ethics that all shops should aspire to if they were not hamstrung by agreements that prohibits certain qualities with repair procedures.



Get insurers out of the repair business, let the collision industry develope their own code of ethics, and make sure insurers do not reward bad behavior. Create your own repair monitoring program for consumer complaints and confront fraud by hiring true experts in body repair that can expose the fraud and poor repairs. Allow authorities to prosecute shops that are in violation and prosecute insurers that tortously interfere with repairers rights to contract, and encourage enforcement of the unfair claims practices acts of every state with severe penalties designed to punish violaters instead of slapping them on the wrist.



Now am I babbling or just bald face lying again?

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