total loss theft/fire claim

Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Tue, 07/29/2008 - 01:15

well here it is, my truck was stolen july 5. when i found out i reported it to the the police and insurance company immediately. The claims rep so far is very nice and helpful. they found my truck 3 days after i reported it stolen, the claims rep calls me and tells me that it is a total loss and that it has been burnt up. the claim rep came to my house and took a recorded statement from me with the details of what i was doing during the moment the truck was parked at a train station. of course the insurance company give me a rental, i ask my claims rep what should i expect next? he says that they have to actually check the truck out and do a couple of other thing in regards to paperwork. I then explained to him that i have to drive roughly 30 miles a day each way for work how long will i have the rental for. 30 days, so now we are 23 days into the claim and everytime the claims rep "updates" me he basically says it is still being investigated. But no one is actually telling me what is goin on, at first they were checking at the train station for cameras, i havent even heard anything about that. i tried to call my claims rep today, he is off on mondays. so i spoke with another claims rep who left a message for a supervisor to call me back. i explained to the claims rep that im getting concerned because we are coming up on the 30 days on the rental and i need to figure out how i will get to work everyday, it would be nice if i had a time frame in which this will be wrapped up. he left a message for the supervisor to call me bcak, i was at work and couldnt answer my phone. the supervisor basically said in a very authoritative tone that the rental expires on the 30 mark and that i am responsible for anything after this, and that they reserve the right to investigate the claim beyond this time frame. not once did i ever yell at anyone or the tone of my voice ever go beyond being polite. whats the deal here, i dont appreciate this guy basically just tellin me so what its your problem. I mean that is how i feel right now, he also went on to say that the claims investigator will be contacting me to collect a statement from me. i already gave a statement to my claims rep. what should i expect from here, i have no other way to get to work and i have a feeling that this is going to beyond 30 days. thanks

Posted: 29 Jul 2008 01:45 Post Subject:

they also had my wife and i both sign a consent form, it basically states that if requested we will provide them with phone records, financial records, med bills, credit checks, etc. what is all of this for, everything is pretty much in order when it comes to financials.

Posted: 29 Jul 2008 05:33 Post Subject:

Well...so its reached up to the claims investigator!!
I'm sure that its enough to indicate that your claim has gone beyond the purview of the adjuster..due to any doubt!!!
Now it is upto the investigator to study your case thoroughly & then pass on their feedbacks to the adjuster..& I must say that the claims investigation could be a process for an longer duration & they are under no obligation to convey their feedbacks to you!! Peculehubb

Posted: 29 Jul 2008 10:02 Post Subject:

Well kind of Peculehubb, sounds like your claim has been turned over to their SIU dept..(special investigation unit) which means there is a fraud concern...don't panic (yet)...when a car stolen THEN burned...that's an automatic red flag which signals car fires fraud ...most genuine car thefts don't burn vehicles they run the crap out of them wreck them, trash them and leave them but they rarely burn them....

Is there anything in your financial information that will add fuel to this fire (no pun intended)? Like late payments especially late or missing car payments? Ever had another total vehicle theft or fire? They do have to tell you the status of the claim...so call again and tell them you understand you only have the rental for 30 days you want to know the status of the claim...

The SIU rep will want an in person (more than likely) interview...they will question you very very methodically...don't lie whatever you do because I assure they have done their homework and them some before they will talk to you...If you have done nothing wrong you have absolutely nothing to worry about...it's just a process that needs to be gone thru...

Please don't hesitate to ask any questions we'd be happy to help where we can...Sorry this happened and hopefully you can get this wrapped up soon..

Posted: 29 Jul 2008 02:57 Post Subject:

how much longer should i expect this process to go on, and i am still paying on the vehicles loan and insurance, what do i do about this? i know in the mean time i am responsible for the loan, but what about after everything is settled, i mean i have been paying a loan and dont even have a vehicle to drive. if this goes beyond the 30days, i have to turn in the rental, or pay for it, do i get any loss of use compensation. my main concern is getting back and forth, i work 25 miles one way from where i live. the bus line dosent go near my place of employment. thanks

Posted: 30 Jul 2008 09:47 Post Subject:

Now way I can guess how long, because I don't know which company or the particulars of the claim, or what they are looking at..That's why you need to call and ask to talk to the investigator. If you can't get an answer then you need to contact your states Dept. of Ins. and file a complaint soon. Your ins company isn't responsible for the terms of your loan, only the ACV of the vehicle...so if you are upside down, then if you GAP ins you need to file a claim if not and there is a balance you will need to work that out with your lein holder...No, no loss of use is owed on these types of claims.

Posted: 31 Jul 2008 02:26 Post Subject:

thanks for the replyies. the company is progressive, the investigator left a message on my home phone telling me that someone from their local attornies office will be contacting me to set up an appointment to give a "explanation under oath", and they are requesting phone records. they also want my wife to do the same, my wifes name was no where on the trucks title or loan, yes she is on the ins policy. why are they concerning my wife and what is an explanation under oath? i feel like since they are involving an attorny that i should get one myself just for my protection and to ensure this process done correctly without trying to screw me. as far as particulars about the claim, basically what happened is my wife and i took our daughter downtown fro the day. this is something that we do a few times a year. my daughter likes to ride the train. so we parked at the train station, went downtown had lunch, did some shopping. about 3 1/2 hrs later we get back to the train station and my truck is gone. to make matters even crazier, there is a police station across the street from the train station. mind you this is not the best of areas, but who would expect something like this and the police station is right there. i went to the police station to report the truck stolen, while the police are working on the report i called my insurance company to inform them what happened. the claims adjuster calls me in about 45 minutes, i explained to him what happened. he comes to my house the next business day to take a recorded statement from me and to get particulars about the truck and so forth. 2 days later i get a call from the police telling me that they found my truck on the other side of town and it is a "burn out". i immediately email my claims adjuster. othe claims guy calls me later in the day to tell me that the truck is a total loss. about 3 days later another guy calls my wife and gets a recorded statement from her, and he was acting like my wife is stupid the way he was questioning her. he would ask her the same thing like 4 diff ways. come to find out its the investigator. this is all roughly within the first week. from this point on up till today, i havent really heard anything else about what the next step is from here. all of a sudden i get a message from the investgator talking about attornies and this explanation under oath. do i have to give another statement since we have already given recorded statements, what should happen from here? i dont like it when anyone starts talking about attornies being involved for the simple fact people are so sneaky these days, and ever since this has happened i have talked with a few people at work and there has been nothing but horror stories. basically they were given the run around for anywhere from 45 days to 3 months before the claim was resolved. and in some cases the people had to get their own legal representation involved and at that point the claim was closed within a matter of days.

Posted: 31 Jul 2008 04:30 Post Subject:

An examination under oath. It's _usually_ done when they suspect fraud was involved. The attorney will ask all kinds of questions, some will be quit frank, and it can last anywhere from 2-6 hours. You can obtain the service of an attorney if you would like but there is little he/she can do for you in in the examination. You are obligated under your policy to give one and your attorney cannot answer for you or tell you not to answer questions.

As mentioned, they are probably investigating possible fraud. From experience I can say that a common reason is that there might not be any indication that the ignition was forced... meaning a key was used to start the vehicle. Of course, I don't know what the situation is in this case.

There is not much else I can say. It's unfortunate that you have to go through this but I don't see any way around it.

Posted: 31 Jul 2008 10:20 Post Subject:

I'm in agreement with T there are some things in your claim that are screaming red flags....T mentioned one, but that in and of it's self wouldn't get an examination under oath going I don't think...SIU yes, but not to the 'next level' with is the EOA....Have you had ANY other total thefts or fires? Are you finances in rough shape especially your vehicle payments? Your policy requires you to produce all records etc...requested including your wifes phone records....if you don't they will more than likely deny the claim.

I'm sorry this is happening, I assure you this is rare and not the norm...they have found something that has them concerned, they would not go to the expense and length if there wasn't something....I'm just going to throw this out here, not that I think you did anything wrong...I'd tell my brother the same thing...If you had anything to do with this...I promise you they already know it, if you're smart you will back out of the claim. If not then more than likely when it's said and done, they will deny the claim AND file criminal charges...I know this company and they don't fool around, they will spend 100k in a second to prove a point....just food for thought...and remember I'm not saying you did anything...just some friendly advise....If you had nothing to do with this at all and it's a clean claim...then hold your head up high and finish this up, the truth will always come out, and you'll be fine. Let us know...

Posted: 02 Aug 2008 05:46 Post Subject:

When an insurer goes to those lengths in the investigation process they surely have a reason to suspect that some sort of fraud is occuring.

I had lunch with a group of insurance brokers this week and we were discussing claims. We discussed a few fraudulent claims and in each case the insurer found proof of the fraud. In each case they gave the insured a chance to back down from the story ...

Why do I say that? Because Lori is right .... IF you are not completely honest about the claim there is a very good chance the insurer has found that out already.

That said, having a lawyer working with you can ease your mind and possibly help you through this. But if the claim is totally legit then you and your wife have nothing to worry about. The interviews will clear things up and make the "red flags" go away for the investigators.

Hope that helps a bit!

It's too bad you don't have an agent or broker to help you through this.

Posted: 22 Aug 2008 12:54 Post Subject:

my wife and i went for the examination yesterday. they asked a lot of questions about our financials. asked if we knew who may have done this. asked more questions about where we were and what we did the day of the incident. what should i expect from here?

Posted: 22 Aug 2008 01:02 Post Subject:

They will check and double check everything...do they already have your phone records? They will check these as well...are you the OP or is this a new post? If new we kind of need to know the facts surrounding the loss, and the reason that fraud is suspected.

Posted: 22 Aug 2008 03:12 Post Subject:

i am the op, i did submit phone records for both my wife and myself. they also went on to say that they had the ignition examined by a forensic specialist and he has determined that a key was used to start the vehicle. and that said key is a coded key for the vehicle. my keys do not have chips in them, nor did i ever have coppies made, and both keys were with me and my wife. could someone be reaidn the report incorrectly from the forensics expert?

Posted: 22 Aug 2008 09:32 Post Subject:

Sure they could, or the thief could work for the dealer etc...somewhere that he/she would have access to getting keys....the thing that got your claim all messed up was the burn after the theft....ask for a copy of the forensic report...then look it over yourself good, also maybe you can call the expert and talk to them about it, and if there are ANY other possiblitys. Man we are coming up on two months! Nothing else has happened except finally the EUO?

Posted: 22 Aug 2008 09:33 Post Subject:

Sorry, remind me were your finances ok? no late or missed payments, (especially vehicle payments) no loss of jobs lately ? no prior burns (of any kind) or theft?

Posted: 22 Aug 2008 11:41 Post Subject:

i have switche jobs voluntarily in the past year, every job opportunity has presented it self with better wages and benefits. finances are ok i would say. my cc are close to the limits but no collections, no late payments. my wifes finances are great, she is really good with money. and NEVER, NEVER, NEVER have we been late on car notes, loans or mortgage. maybe a few late payments on cc in the past year. the investigator did call me and question some deposits on my acc, past jobs were not only hourly but commision based jobs. so they owed me money, and back pay from previous jobs, in addition to money that i may have loaned out to family memebers. they pay me back, and the money goes into my acc, i mean who just walks around with money in their pocket. if i already have 40-50 bucks on me and i get a check or some cash im going to naturally put it into my account, not just walk aroung with it for no reason. i do have 2 car loans that they questioned as well. when i bought the truck, i gave my old car to my mom with the understanding that she is totally responsible for paying the loan. i paid the loan biweekly and my mom reimbursed me for the payments with either check or cash. this investigato turns around and asked for my mothers contact info. he calls her and starts drilling her with questions about why is the car still in my name if she is purchasing it, and what is the deal why am i driving it now? my mother politely explained the deal that we had worked out in detail what we were doing and that she is lending me the car in the mean time until i can get another one. the car will be going back to her once i get situated through this. he then asks her if he minds if he records her statement. now my moms health is not the best, roughly over the past 5-6 years she has had about 4-5 abdominal surgeies for various reasons. the investigator calls my mom as she is coming out of the doctors office and she is in horrendous pain, has been for about 3 months now. she finds out that not only is there a possibilty that she may have ovarian cancer but she has 3, count them 1...2...3.. hernias. so needless to say she is really in no mood for an interogation. after he asked her if he could record her statement and to repeat herself again, she explains to him that she can barely walk and that she is leaving the doctors office as we speak, that she is in no condition to go through this right now, it hurts for her to even speak and she politely told him that she had to go.

Posted: 23 Aug 2008 12:10 Post Subject:

and also i am ahead on the loan for the car that i gave to my mom, i paid it up for about two months because i knew that at some point in time she would be getting surgery yet again for what ever reason. her health justa hasent been the same since she had the gastric bypass.

Posted: 23 Aug 2008 10:39 Post Subject:

POOR MOM! wow! (I'll certainly say a prayer for her recovery)...She handled that wonderfully and better than I would've! I reallly don't understand their questioning your finances to this degree. Late, missing payments financial trouble, yes, that's a motive to steal and burn a car, depositing money, no...big withdraw to pay the theif maybe but that's a stretch....

Were I you, I think it's time to tell them to "Put up or shut up you've been a stand up guy and helped all you can...they have more than enough information to make a decision...pay it or deny it either way you're filing a complaint with the Dept of Ins...and the next step is getting an attorney and pursueing a bad faith claim...this has went on too far, and you pushed the evelope buddy when you messed with my mom!!!"....then DO IT...

Please do let us know how it's going and if we can be of any further assistance, which company and what state again? This is just stupid at this point..i figured it was all settled by now! man carriers like this really tick me off...I see the red flags in the claim, but once they are lowerd, pay the damn thing! Sorry gives my job a bad name!

Posted: 23 Aug 2008 12:31 Post Subject:

the company is progressive, in the state of ohio. thank for your concerns about my mother. it is very kind of you to have her in your prayers. im trying to be patient and cooperation with them so that they cant say that i havent been doing my part. in our last conversation with the investigator he did tell that they should hopefully have an answer for me in a weeks time. im going to hold them to this, if naything else happens then i will be going the dept of ins. i can honestly say that the investigator has been very nice towards me. i have heard stories of how people can be treated like crap through this whole ordeal. he went on to say that he was shocked that i brought in all the paperwork requested because ussually insureds dont bring half of the items. i know he has a job to do and that does consist of treating me with respect, i did expect a totally diff attitude from him in the beginning. but still the fact remains that this is getting a little reidculous and time consuming. i will keep posting till this is resolved. thanks everyone.

Posted: 23 Aug 2008 12:48 Post Subject:

Progressive is one of the companys that is VERY through and will spend 100k to prosecute a 10k fraud...and I can appreciate that...You also are in their 'home' state...that works both ways...they don't want bad press in Ohio...I'm glad the SIU rep is being respectful it's a very difficult job...I know from experience...and as I said initally a theft that then total burns is a huge red flag...hopefully this will be resolved within a week...please keep us in the loop...

Posted: 28 Aug 2008 05:28 Post Subject:

spoke with the inverstigator earlier this week, he had more simple questions. he did say that he is wrapping his end up and that I should hear from my claims rep by friday. he did also mention that the claims rep has to give everything to his sup firts and then contact me. so, what should i expect?

Posted: 28 Aug 2008 05:33 Post Subject:

so, what should i expect?

That the sun should rise in the morning. This is about all we can count on. :) If I were to guess I'd say there is a 99.99% chance that they will pay the claim. I think it would have stayed with the SIU investigator if not. The adjusters supervisor probably just needs to okay the payment since it was in SIU.

Posted: 28 Aug 2008 05:44 Post Subject:

LOL, you made me laugh with the sun comment!!! i will be sure to update you guys if i hear anything else. thanks for all of the advice.

Posted: 28 Aug 2008 06:20 Post Subject:

The claims reps supervisor will follow what the SIU guy's recommendation is...if he recommended denying the claim then it would have to go higher than the supervisor to get a rubber stamp on the denial....if the siu guys opinion is that they should pay the claim (can't prove anything in court)....then the supervisor will just have to put something in the claim telling the rep to pay it...sounds like you are on the home stretch now....

so, what should i expect?

To have to pay taxes and eventually croak. :wink:

Posted: 29 Aug 2008 02:11 Post Subject:

i just spoke with my claims rep and he said that his management is scheduled to look over everything the middle of next week and that i should hear from him by the end of next week. the investigator said that i should have an answer by this friday (today). im really frustrated now, should i give them their week of should move forward and ask them if they could do this any sooner? i dont know what to do at this point, i dont want to file a complaint and seem like an a$$hole towards them but this i going on 2 months now. any suggestions? thanks

Posted: 29 Aug 2008 04:16 Post Subject:

I can't tell you what you should do, that is up to you. But I'll mentioned that I doubt they would speed up the process as it's only a week (and a long weekend before then). I understand it's frustrating on your end and if you did nothing wrong you should not have to wait.

Posted: 29 Aug 2008 07:13 Post Subject:

"It MIGHT just be that" ALL the managers are at a meeting that has went on all week...doubt that pushing will accomplish anything at all this week....I would however call tues/wed/thurs/friday...siu guy probably didn't realize that it is 'possible' there was a meeting/conference..that didn't complete till late today, then travel back.... :wink:

Posted: 08 Sep 2008 06:30 Post Subject:

just spoke with the claims adjuster, and they are denying my claim stating that it was an intentional act on my part. i asked how is it determined that i did this? i was no where around. they went on to say that i should recieve a letter in the mail shortly. im am so upset right now, i almost typed in some words that wouldnt have been appropriate!! what are my options from here? I had absolutely nothing to due with this. i feel so sick.

Posted: 08 Sep 2008 09:57 Post Subject:

Oh my gosh...well I will say they never deny a claim for this reason without A LOT of information to back it up...after you get the letter let us know EXACTLY what it says, we'll be in a better position to advise you then...whether the DOI, or a private attorney is the way to go...so sorry you're having such trouble hang in there...

Posted: 08 Sep 2008 10:04 Post Subject:

i cant even fathom why this would be the outcome. i am so depressed right now. i wanted to scream at the claims rep when she told me this, but i told myself to stay calm, dont do anything that work against me later. i will be sure to update you as soon as i get the letter.

Posted: 09 Sep 2008 09:31 Post Subject:

You did the right thing staying calm, wasn't her decision anyway I assure you...that came from a couple of steps above her...try to remember that if you are clean this will come out just fine....try not to be too upset, I know that's easier said that done....we'll do all we can to assist you , in the mean while start doing some research on some HIGH powered attorneys in your area that maybe even have battled Progressive before, if this turns into a bad faith claim that ''could'' be big money...start checking around...and no fly by night ambulance chancers...

Posted: 09 Sep 2008 01:28 Post Subject:

thank you for your encouraging words. i tried to do a search for bad faith claims lawyers and i cant even tell who is truly experienced in this field. i have done some research and there a lot of cases simular to mine where the claim was denied, the insured fought it and the insurance company ussually settled once the insured can prove the company wrong in their decision. but i am a little worried because i have read cases where charges have been put on innocent people, the insurance company speculated that the insured had something to do with the loss and the insured ended up getting the shaft. well, we will just wait for the letter and see what happens.

Posted: 09 Sep 2008 08:44 Post Subject:

hang in there, we'll see how it looks for you keep trying to find an attorney that will take this on a contengency basis, if indeed you can prove bad faith that is big money, and most atty's will jump on it, but it takes a long long time, minimally once you know all the facts you need to file a complaint with your states DOI, however I assure you your carrier has already filed a report with them...however, they should and will complete their own investigation once you file a complaint...i think that you need to wait though until you get all the facts.

Posted: 10 Sep 2008 02:16 Post Subject:

If I wanted to get into the business of insurance at a later time, how would this affect my chances of getting a license from the doi

Posted: 10 Sep 2008 03:38 Post Subject:

also how is this going to affect our rates when we shop around, how do i explain this to the agent im shopping with? should my wife and i get seperate policies?

Posted: 10 Sep 2008 07:10 Post Subject:

If I wanted to get into the business of insurance at a later time, how would this affect my chances of getting a license from the doi

Course it will depend on how this ends up...and honestly I don't know..

also how is this going to affect our rates when we shop around, how do i explain this to the agent im shopping with? should my wife and i get seperate policies?


Doubt separate policys would be the way to go....you will have to disclose this, just the claim if it's on the application for insurance never never never lie or mis rep on an app...you entire policy/period can be voided....

Posted: 11 Sep 2008 12:57 Post Subject:

Also, why would they be fileing a report with the doi? I've done some more reading online and there has been a few cases like mine, the insured got a lawyer to persue their case and then the insirance com threatened to press charges on them. Well they did press charges and the insured was determined to be inocent in the end but they lost their job, amongst other issues that arose from the situation. He was cleared of the charges and compensated an undisclosed amount after about 1 and half yeara after his claim took place. Why is so east for the insurance company todo this to people? Yes there those that commit fraud then there are those that are legit. Truly, we are guilty until proven innocent with no help but our own. I'm so disgusted at this situation.

Posted: 11 Sep 2008 12:59 Post Subject:

What rights do I have as far as getting any and available items from them to support their denial

Posted: 11 Sep 2008 10:09 Post Subject:

Also, why would they be fileing a report with the doi

I don't know if it's a state thing or what..I do know that in MO they file some kind of report, guess maybe 'fraud denial' with the DOI here when a claim is denied based on fraud...

As far are the info they will need to provide you (you might have to request it) detailed information regarding their reason/basis of denying your claim...

Frankly it's not easy for carriers to do this...they have to be very careful and have all their ducks in a row...That undisclosed amount I'm betting was a bad faith claim...

Let's see what information they provide regarding your denial, you will need all the info you can get for an attorney anyway...You might call the adjuster back and tell her you understand this was a decision she made alone, but if they are sending you a standard denial letter you need to have specifics, meaning you want the EXACT reasons they have denied your claim.

Have you found an attorney yet?

Posted: 11 Sep 2008 07:01 Post Subject:

called the cleveland barr association, they refered me to someone that experienced with insurance law. after they took all of my info they said that they can take my case however the retainer is $1500. i told them i dont have that type of money to spare right now, they went on to say that they cannot do it on a contigency basis. back to square one!!!! i havent recieved the letter yet, also i tried to log into my policy last night. apperently they are canceling my coverage effective 10/10/2008. thats ok, i planned on switching anyway due to the bad experience. should i also be talking to an attorney about them trying to press charges, or do they (the insurance company) have to have clear proof that i did this (which is not the case)? thanks for all of the advise.

Posted: 11 Sep 2008 08:10 Post Subject:

ok, i called the claims adjuster that is filling in for my original one. he has been on vacation for 2 weeks now. i kindly explained to her that i havent received the letter, and i was also calling to see if there is any info that she can give in regards to specifics for the denial. she said that i havent recieved the denial yet because it was fowarded to the original claims rep, she will get it and send it to me. she then stated that she would have to review my file and call me back later. so that is where everything is at this point.

Posted: 12 Sep 2008 09:18 Post Subject:

should i also be talking to an attorney about them trying to press charges, or do they (the insurance company) have to have clear proof that i did this (which is not the case)? thanks for all of the advise.

Have they got criminal charges filed? Or are they discussing this with the prosecutor? Of course if charges are filed then you'll know when they come to arrest you...so most certainly if that happens you'll need an attorney...Where did that come from (charges)? Who mentioned that to you?

I'd try and call THAT rep back this afternoon to see if they know anything yet.

Posted: 12 Sep 2008 12:17 Post Subject:

i got the thought from reading up on other insurance situations on the web. i dont think itll come to that, i think i migh be thinking about the situation too much. i am expecting a call from the rep, if i dont hear from her later then i will most definetely be calling her. im assuming its standard for a the policy to get cancelled in a situation like this?

Posted: 12 Sep 2008 12:32 Post Subject:

im assuming its standard for a the policy to get cancelled in a situation like this

sure it is if they are denying a claim based on fraud.

Posted: 15 Sep 2008 08:20 Post Subject:

finally got the letter and spoke with the claims rep. the letter has an exclusion listed that is contained in my policy stating that intentional acts are not covered and that they are denying my claim based on this. they said that they determined this was an act on my behalf. i called the claims adjuster and asked what is it that makes them belive that this is intentional? she said that the investigator said that there was no way possible for someone to steal my truck without my knowledge based on the survelence video obtained from the train station. i did have the opportunity to view the video. it shows my wife my daughter and myself all getting out of the truck, and walking into the train station. then the investigator switches to an inside view of the station, and he points out a guy video looking around. he questions if i knew this person, but i couldnt see his face, the investigator even acknowledged that the video is poor and he cant make out the face. then the investigator switches to the view of my truck, this same guy walks up to my truck and pulls on the handle of the passenger side. to my amazement the door opens, i always used my key fob to lock the doors. i now know that these things are not 100% reliable. i always assumed that if the horn signals then it worked!! he then gets into the truck closes the door, then gets out and goes around to the drivers side and gets in. in about 20 seconds after getting in on the drivers side, he drives off in my truck. the video didnt have a good picture, couldnt make out his face. my wife and i had both keys on our person. the investigator then said that there is no way the truck couldve been started this fast with out a key. i never made any keys and never authorized any keys to be made. i asked the claims rep if they had some sort of appeals process or what is there that i can do to convince them that i did not do this? she said that she can have the sup of my original claims rep call me. looking at it from their stand point, i can see where they are coming from. but if everything else checked out (any "red flags"), and i have cooperated with everything you have asked, wouldnt you stop and think "well maybe he really didnt do this". my wife and i started thinking and back tracking to all the times we have handed the a key over to someone. there are numerous times we have gone out to eat, to events, to hotels, etc that required us to leave our keys with the valet or what not. it seems like a bit much for someone to do this, but at this point in my mind i wouldnt put it past someone (valet) to actually make a key for later usage if the insurance company is saying that a key was used to start the truck based upon examining the ignition. well then they should be able to tell if one my keys were used, just like a forensics expert can tell what gun a bullet came from (if there is a gun to compare it to). i assure you that both keys were in our possesion. now that i have gotten what info they are denying my claim on i am going to contact a few attornies and see if they can do something for me. i have done some research on this and their forensic expert should be able to tell what was the last key used to start the truck if they take the ignition apart and clean any debris out, but it has been proven that they rarley do this. it has also been said that alot of these forensics experts use their credentials and previous case knowledge to come up with their findings instead of actually doing "everything".

Posted: 16 Sep 2008 09:45 Post Subject:

the investigator then said that there is no way the truck couldve been started this fast with out a key

If the column shows nothing was tampered with they have a key..I disagree that a car thief cannot start a car that fast without a key they most certainly can and in less time! but if the column is undisturbed then a a key was used...I've done some research...tell you what why don't you call (as an experiment) your dealership or the manufactor of your vehicle give them the VIN etc...and see if you can get a key, with that information alone...tell them you've lost the keys...bet you can buy one...It is NOT YOUR JOB to figure out where another key came from..these things happen....if you are clean everywhere else...then they are going to have to pay this claim...they have VERY flemsy evidence...I've also found articles that say car theifs are burning cars to distroy dna evidence...news to me...I didn't know that....makes sense but I'd never heard this either...that's why your theft and burn thru up red flags to me too....you need to get an attorney and contact your states Dept of Ins and file a complaint..

the investigator even acknowledged that the video is poor and he cant make out the face

but you can make out his clothes and prove it isn't you...right?

Posted: 16 Sep 2008 01:16 Post Subject:

my point exactly, some there are resources outide of my wife and i as far as getting a key. and yes you can clearly see that the person in the video isnt me by the clothes and the build of the this person. im about 5'10" 240lbs (no wise cracks ok!!!!), this person appeared to be of small stature and wieghing no more then 160lbs soaking wet!!! thank you for all of your help, i will show my appreciaition in the form of a donation in the next few days. you have help me to keep a calm head through this, my wife has also helped me stay calm but at the same time i have had to keep her calm. she was a bit upset that they questioned her, her logic is it isnt her vehicle and she didnt file the claim. and then denying the claim just got her all worked up, she has managed to handle herself appropriately. she dosent like for people to be in our privaate business, and im fully with her on that. i explained to her that this is something that has to be done to get things back to right. looks as though we are going to have to more then just cooperate with the insurance company, i.e. consult an attorney.

Posted: 16 Sep 2008 03:11 Post Subject:

i just spoke with a co-worker of mine, just found out they used to work for an insurance company. they said that there is a strong possibility that if the insurance feels that i had something to do with this then they will be pressing charges against me. but there is nothing that shows that i was involved in this. this is what frightens me the most. i can lose my job and everything at home will just fall to peices. my wife and i work as a team, we arent able to just rely on 1 income to take care of everything.

Posted: 16 Sep 2008 11:23 Post Subject:

that if the insurance feels that i had something to do with this then they will be pressing charges against me. but there is nothing that shows that i was involved in this. this is what frightens me the most. i can lose my job and everything at home will just fall to peices. my wife and i work as a team, we arent able to just rely on 1 income to take care of everything

An insurance company's basis to deny a claim, and a prosecutors level of evidence are two entirely different things....they would have to have proof that you had something to do with this to move forward with an insuranc fraud charge and the procesuting attorney would have to agree there is enough evidence for a conviction...All I have to base my part of the conversation is your postings...and I see nothing, in the way of PROOF.

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