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 Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 3:20 am Post subject: I get all my clients to sign this and you should also |
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This is worth it weight in gold. I suggest that you get your clients to sign it. I can't tell you how many times, it have help the agent, when a client lied on the application.
Applicant's Statement of Truth and Acknowledgement
I hereby acknowledge that all my answers given on application(s) for life, long term care, cancer and/or health insurance today, ___________________2009 are true and complete to the best of my belief and knowledge.
I will review the application(s) completely to make sure all answers are correct and complete before signing such application(s).
I fully understand that an insurance company can later rescind a policy or deny/reduce a claim/benefit due to my application answers that were not knowingly truthful in fact, misrepresented, or lacked material information known by me. This information includes, but is not limited to, my current and past medical history as well s any tobacco usage.
Furthermore, I will not hold you, my agent, responsible in any manner whatsoever should a company later rescind a policy or deny/reduce a claim/benefit for these reasons.
________________________________
Applicant/Owner
__________________________
Agent
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Witness/Beneficiary (if available)
This form should be retained by the agent.
A copy may also be given to the applicant/owner.
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Mark Rosenthal
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http://www.rosenthalfiles.com |
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lifeagent911
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| Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 5:01 am Post subject: |
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| Good form... but if you presented it to me I'd walk away and use another agent. I don't like the part about not holding you responsible if my claim is denied for any reason. If you _are_ responsible in some way, I'd want the ability to hold you accountable. |
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tcope
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| Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:41 am Post subject: |
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lifeagent911... I'm not sure why you would bother with such a thing???
The application itself has the fraud warning anyway right above where the applicant signs.
Below is the actual language on (Florida) applications:
| Quote: | The Owner agrees to the following:
The answers in this application are true to the best of my knowledge and belief. The effective date of the Contract will be the Contract Date set by the Company. No agent or person other than the President or Secretary of the Company has the authority to change or modify the Contract or waive any of its provisions.
Any person who knowingly and with intent to injure, defraud, or deceive any insurer files a statement of claim or an application containing any false, incomplete, or misleading information is guilty of a felony of the third degree. |
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Gary Spicuzza, *SAFE
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GarySpicuzza
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| Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 2:04 pm Post subject: |
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tcope
It does not say for any reason. It says for these reason. If you lie on the application, it will not be my fault, if the company holds it against you.
If you don't want to sign it, I would not sell it to you. Only clients that are going to lie or defraud the company would not sign it.
The same thing is on just about any application there is. But it protects the company, more then the agent.
This form is really for the agent to show to the company, when they find out the client was lying.
Example: A lot of clients lie about smoking. When they are caught, they blame the agent. The agent told me to lie about it or I told the agent and he didn't write it down. I then can show this to the company to stop them from firing me.
If you don't lie on the application, then you as a client have nothing to worry about. It does not say for any reason.
Furthermore, I will not hold you, my agent, responsible in any manner whatsoever should a company later rescind a policy or deny/reduce a claim/benefit for these reasons.
answers that were not knowingly truthful in fact, misrepresented, or lacked material information known by me. <--- these reason, meaning this
If you would not sign it because you are worry about if you knowingly are not truthful, misrepresent yourself, then I don't want to sell you the policy.
By the way, you will sign the same thing on the application already. This just hold the agent harmless if you lie. I'm sorry this offends you.
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Mark Rosenthal
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lifeagent911
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| Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 3:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Example: A lot of clients lie about smoking. When they are caught, they blame the agent. The agent told me to lie about it or I told the agent and he didn't write it down. I then can show this to the company to stop them from firing me. |
I don't see how this would protect you from them still saying you told them to lie...it's just word against word, and if you write for a company that would fire you for this (without proof) there's a problem...I personally don't see any difference in this and the mis rep statements on the policy...you said it protects you more than the company, I don't know that it would... actually if I were you since this is clearly redundant, I would change the wording to something like, 'and i further agree that said agent_______________ did not advise me to mis-represent any information on this application, said agent also read me the mis-rep statement in full and cautioned me regarding the need of full disclosure and truth''...or something similar, that i would think would halt any e&o claim re: mis-rep. (just my opinion)
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Lori
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| Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 3:55 pm Post subject: |
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You don't have to use those exact words, but the concept is the same.
The truth is that you will have clients that lie on the application. When the company finds out that they lied, they will sometimes blame the agent also.
I try my best to tell the client how important it is not to lie on the application. I always take some time and go over why it is important not to lie and then I have them sign this. I've also had the client after seeing this, come back and tell me the truth about something they were going to lie about.
I have seen many companies fire an agent, because of a client lieing on an application. It is not always on the 1st app, where the client lies to the company. Also, it always helps to have something to show in your defense to the company or Ins Dept.
Also, I would say that half of the agents I talk to don't have e and o insurance.
The point is, you need to have something, you decided how it is worded, that makes it clear that the client should not lie and you stressed this point to him and told them if they lied what could happen.
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lifeagent911
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| Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Also, I would say that half of the agents I talk to don't have e and o insurance. |
 what? i thought that would be required! maybe it's a state thing...I don't know any agent that does not have an e&o 
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Lori
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| Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 6:22 pm Post subject: |
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Some Insurance Companies require it. Many don't. Most of my companies don't.
I'm talking about Life Insurance.
Also, you would be shocked to find out what E and O does not cover.
Some agents don't invest the 700 to 1000 bucks a year to have it.
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lifeagent911
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| Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 3:41 am Post subject: insurance |
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| SOOOOOOOOOo............your saying those who REFUSE to sign such a 'document' (I use that term loosely) is lying on their Insurance application? that is just so D**N ignorant to say. SOME medical issues are actually covered under the HIPAA law. I'm ASSUMING you know this, being in the field that you are in. |
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sdchargersfan
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| Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 4:16 am Post subject: |
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What do you mean by some medical issues are coverage by hippa? Are you trying to saw that the client can lie to the company and agent because they are covered by Hippaa. Yes, I know all about hipaa. That is why you must sign the hipaa form in order to buy insurance or I can't help you.
Yes, I'm saying that those who refuse to sign something saying in a contract that they will not lie, is probley up to no good. Everyone that has ever bought life insurance, has signed this already if they stopped and read what they were signing.
I was hipaa trained. I've been trained in many areas that the avg insurance agent is not. I'm also trained in underwriting. Where did you get your training from?
I don't think I'm ignorant by anything that I've said. For those that don't sign it on the contract/ policy or on my extra sheet of paper, then I don't want you as my client. Out of the thousands of applications that I've written, I've never had a client refuse to sign it. It is weird that is offends you.
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lifeagent911
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| Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 11:27 am Post subject: insurance |
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| A friend of mine has a 'pre-existing' Medical condition, that is 'covered' under the HIPAA Law. 'His' Insurance company refused to sell him Life Insurance if he did not sign a similar form ('not responsible for...). His Mother was POA. When my friend passed away, his mother sued the Insurance company and won. |
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sdchargersfan
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| Posted: Thu Jan 01, 2009 12:02 pm Post subject: |
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sdchargersfan, I believe you have some of your information crossed or you are simply mistaken.
Regarding, The Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, the operative word there is HEALTH as in HEALTH INSURANCE.
See and read THIS LINK.
| Quote: | | The P in HIPAA stands for portability of medical coverage. This part of HIPAA went into effect on July 1, 1997. On the date the plan or insurer becomes subject to the HIPAA provisions, the plan or insurer may not exclude coverage for any pre-existing medical conditions for more than 12 months after an individual's enrollment date (18 months for a late enrollee). |
| Quote: | | A friend of mine has a 'pre-existing' Medical condition, that is 'covered' under the HIPAA Law. |
Pre-existing conditions can be EXCLUDED from coverage for 12 to 18 months.
| Quote: | | 'His' Insurance company refused to sell him Life Insurance if he did not sign a similar form ('not responsible for...). |
HIPPA has zero to do with life insurance EXCEPT the medical information privacy statement that nobody reads that says,... they can share your medical information with just about any governmental agency and/or insurance company and/or the Medical Information Bureau and others.
I don't know what you mean with ('not responsible for...) You said this was LIFE INSURANCE, what is it he's ('not responsible for...)?
| Quote: | | His Mother was POA. When my friend passed away, his mother sued the Insurance company and won. |
Again you've probably mixed unrelated things together.
Mom may very well have sued the HEALTH INSURER for denying some claim.
There is no such thing as ("pre-existing' Medical condition, that is 'covered' under the HIPAA Law") for LIFE INSURANCE. Most group life plans are guaranteed issued so they've already build adverse selection into the rates.
From THIS LINK.
| Quote: | | The Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA)1 was passed on August 21, 1996. Among other things, it included rules covering administrative simplification, and making healthcare delivery more efficient. Portability of medical coverage for pre-existing conditions was a key provision of the act as was defining the underwriting process for group medical coverage. |
AND just because one may have a pre-exitsing medical condition that may or may not be subject to the 12 month exclusion that does not mean you don't have to disclose the condition to the insurer.
Thread wars are fun!
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Gary Spicuzza, *SAFE
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*Self Appointed Financial Expert |
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GarySpicuzza
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| Posted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 3:30 am Post subject: insurance |
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GARY.........It's fun 'fighting' with ya, too!!  When I said, "Not responsible for...", I was referring to the form the AGENT was talking about...the ones he said if 'his' clients din't sign it, he wouldn't sell them a policy. The HIPAA Law......my friend was HIV..AIDS. He din't have to divuldge any of that information to any sort of Insurance. |
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sdchargersfan
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| Posted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 3:51 am Post subject: |
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Wow!! You think someone can have HIV or AIDS and does not have to divuldge that info to the insurance company and still buy the insurance.
Hipaa just says that there is certain private infomation that can not be shared without your permission to someone else. Example, you doctor can't tell me that you have aids. Whenever you buy any kind of health or life insurance, we put a hippa form in front of you to sign. If you don't sign it giving us permission to access your mib/rx and a number of sources, then we walk away and you don't get the insurance.
I think it is really funny that you keep trying to play insurance agent and tell us what the laws are and you are clueless to what the hippa law really is. When you having training on hippa, or get an Insurance Lic, then talk to me about Hippa or what you think the law is. LOL
Your right about the client don't have to buy the insurance and don't have to tell us anything, or sign anything. We don't have to sell him the insurance or give him the coverage if he don't sign it.
I think when you said the following that you were clueless.
"A friend of mine has a 'pre-existing' Medical condition, that is 'covered' under the HIPAA Law. 'His' Insurance company refused to sell him Life Insurance if he did not sign a similar form ('not responsible for...). His Mother was POA. When my friend passed away, his mother sued the Insurance company and won."
I don't think you have a clue as to what the Hipaa law is.
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lifeagent911
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| Posted: Fri Jan 02, 2009 5:16 am Post subject: insurance |
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| In the field that I work in, I deal with HIPAA everyday. No.........my friend did NOT have to reveal anything to anyone. Maybe that's why his mother WON a lawsuit with an Insurance company. OR....................did you NOT read that part., AGENT. I live in a VERY small town. This certain Insurance company is in THIS town. When the news traveled about the Lawsuit, BELIEVE ME!!.......that Insurance company LOST alot of clients...they are actually thinking of 'closing their doors'. I work with a 'client' now, who recently ( less than 7 months ago....) found out she is HIV+. BY LAW she doesn't have to tell A SOUL!!!!!!! I deal with her Life Insurance AND her Medical Insurance policies/issues. When my 'client' find this info out ( that she is HIV+..) I called her agents who handle her policies ( Medical and Life) and told them she NOW has a "change in her Health." I ALSO told them, because of the HIPAA LAW I was NOT obligated to SAY what that "change" is. They can do NOTHING about that......if they try, my 'client' will sue. |
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sdchargersfan
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