How do direct repair programs work?

Message Author
ampm-bookmark
delicious-small Add to delicious
yahoomyweb-small Add to YahooMyWeb
blinklist-small Add to BlinkList
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 2:36 pm   Post subject: How do direct repair programs work?  

Thought it best to start a new topic. Maybe there's people out there that have questions about DRP's and the shops that become one.



I've got quite a bit of experience with the direct repair program process and it's ups and downs, yes. There's a fair bit that goes on behind the scenes, and that's where I see some headaches.



Do you have any experience with them where you are? What do you think of them?

AutoBodybyJake
New member
Leave a quick message



Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 39


17.13 Dollars($)

PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 1:16 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
Do you have any experience with them where you are? What do you think of them?
Oh yes, tons...I'm currently a direct repair program rep for a large insurance company...I've also been a shop manager (for a large shop) and have been on that side as well...



Like all things in life there are good ones and bad ones....I think it's always important to remember that as the vehicle owner you have the choice where to repair your vehicle...Are there 'perks' associated with using a drp darn right there are....are they ALWAYS the best choice, maybe not....with most direct repair programs, the shops have to meet certain standards, both with their equipment, insurance, and tech certifications...Most important to the consumer would be that the repairs are backed not only by the shop it's self but generally also by the carrier...Which is a hard thing to find...what other industry backs (in writing) another person/businesses work?


_________________

"Never, never be afraid to do what's right, especially if the well being of a person or animal is at stake. Society's punishments are small compared to the wounds we inflict on our soul when we look the other way." Martin Luther King Jr.
Lori
Forum Expert
Leave a quick message

Lori
Forum Expert

Joined: 10 Sep 2007
Posts: 8080

Location: Missouri
287.93 Dollars($)

PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 6:31 am   Post subject:   

Quote:
Most important to the consumer would be that the repairs are backed not only by the shop it's self but generally also by the carrier...




Yeah, that's remained the greatest concern for any customer. I feel butterflies in my stomach whenever my car walks into a body shop for repairs. And i experience lack of sleep during the phase. I normally prefers the direct repair programs, because i don't have to take the pain of monitoring the repair works day in and day out. But I've also seen some of friends to feel comfortable going to their chosen body shops because they simply don't trust the enlisted repairers.

_________________
Register Now to have your Insurance queries solved.
CarlosPererra
Guest







PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 6:53 am   Post subject:   

Well I've experienced that the adjuster exerts some kind of pressure to enroll the customers under the direct repair program. And that makes me uneasy and skeptical about their true intention.



The body shops, under the direct repair programs are required to fix the car as cheaply as possible to save money for the insurer. The insurer and the body shops definite go hand in hand to low ball your claim and fix your car with below standard parts. What are my options if I feel that they are deliberately devaluing my claim ? The adjuster is definitely going to stick to the quote given by the bodyshop. Confused


_________________
Register Now to have your Insurance queries solved.
Aurther
Guest







PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2008 1:55 pm   Post subject:   

Let me see if I can clear up a few things re: Direct repair programs



CarlosPererra----

Quote:
And i experience lack of sleep during the phase. I normally prefers the DRPs, because i don't have to take the pain of monitoring the repair works day in and day out
Sorry you lose sleep over vehicle repair first of all, although it's a pain in anyone's butt when their vehicle is out of service and being repaired...you make a valid point in that it is not your responsiblity rather the adjusters to monitor the repair and keep it on track in a direct repair program (or should be Rolling Eyes ) thus removing this burden from you.
Quote:
But I've also seen some of friends to feel comfortable going to their chosen body shops because they simply don't trust the enlisted repairers.
I heard this all the time, and if a person has another shop they prefer then that's fine, and they should certainly use the shop of their choice but to refuse one simply because it is a DRP I think is foolish. And in many cases they are cutting off their nose to spite their own faces...(if that's the only reason)..You should understand as well that the DRP shops have to meet pretty high standards...thus eliminating 'not so good' shops in some cases...(not all mind you, some companies will only allow a certain number of shops in an area, and I'm not saying in any way shape or form that if a shop isn't a DRP then they are a bad shop...so don't go there please... Wink just that the DRP's go thru many steps-generally-to be considered a DRP)





Now, Aurther---
Quote:
Well I've experienced that the adjuster exerts some kind of pressure to enroll the customers under the direct repair program. And that makes me uneasy and skeptical about their true intention
I can see how that could make you uneasy, and there is some pressure, but let me see if I can tell you what it truly is...rather than simple non-fact based assumptions and wide ranging allegations on your part...



First most companys that have DRP's their adjusters are to refer a certain percentage to these shops for alot of reasons, and one is cost BUT NOT THE WAY YOU ARE THINKING...it lowers the COST OF THE CLAIMS HANDLING...NOT NECESARILY THE COST OF THE REPAIR...allow me to explain...if you go to a DRP (depends on the company and how their programs are run, but this will be pretty darn close for all of them)...Let's assume this is the way the drp runs (most are this way, the company I work for however is not, and I'll explain that in a minute)....The vehicle is referred to the DRP...the shop (not an adjuster) writes the estimate and photos the vehicle, and either uploads it for approval or begins repairs...now, the company has already saved a couple of hundred dollars, by the shop doing this rather than an adjuster going out and doing it...The DRP shop is supposed to put these vehicles at the top of the repair list, meaning these cars are fixed first....now we've saved several hundred more dollars (presumeably) in rental car bills...The car after it's repaired has a problem...the ower goes back to the DRP and the shop resolves the issue, either gets authorization from the ins carrier or just does it...again, several hundred more dollars saved because the adjuster didnt' have to go back out..or hire and monitor an independent appraiser to do the same see? And if an independent is called in now, you have to add their fee to the claim.... Now mulitply that by thousands and thousands of claims...how much of a savings is that?



Now why does the adjuster want you to use the DRP so bad? As I said they are supposed to refer a certain percentage, (part of their goals) also (and this is the MAIN REASON I assure you)...because then the adjuster gets out of A LOT OF WORK! Once it's referred then either the DRP rep or the shop handles the rest! That is a no-brainer (I don't care who or what industry your in)...if the owner chooses a non-drp then the adjuster either has to go inspect and photo the vehicle write an estimate negotiate it with the shop go back to the shop if there is a supplement, then go back again if there is a re-work issue....does that make more sense?





Quote:
The body shops, under the DR programs are required to fix the car as cheaply as possible to save money for the insurer
This ''might'' be true in a small percentage, but I would say that this is an uninformed statement without any proof to back it up..or if you do have proof, put it forth....All insurance companies have guidelines re: vehicle repair, and they are going to write or pay to repair that car the same at a DRP or non-DRP shop...and do you really think that all shops are crooks? The DRP shops are typcially top of the line shops, with great buisness ethics...Do you really think they are going to repair your vehicle to subpar standards? I'm not going to say that there may not be a dispute from time to time regarding a particular operation, there are, but there are in all shops.......frankly I think this is a bigger slap in the face of the shops than the insurer..do you really think there are that many shop out there that would sign up for a drp ''requiring'' them to fix cars the cheapest way possible, (the inferance you have made of course is sub-standard work, they are of course 'required' to repair it the most cost effect means, but wouldn't you require the same if you were paying the bill?)..



Some DRP shops give carriers a lower labor rate, or parts discount (the co i work for there is none), but that still doesn't mean the repairs are not completely properly...just because the bottom line is lower than ''billy bob's body shop'' down the street doesn't mean billy bob didn't inflate his sheet does it?





Quote:
The insurer and the body shops definite go hand in hand to lowball your claim and fix your car with below standard parts.




Such a bold statement, prove it!!!!!!...again you are calling all shops (and carriers) crooks.....and I take personal offense at this statement...I NEVER have 'lowballed' a repair in my life...do I write after market, used, or reman parts to repair some vehicles if it meets the guideline, of course...do you buy/use generic medication or do you pay top dollar for OEM? Do you always buy name brand everything? Or the store brand if it's just as good? A/m parts have come a long long way in the past 20 years...and frankly CAPA certified parts (which are the only ones my company and I think all companies will use-and all companys have guidelines and restrictions regarding their use) carry a longer warranty that oem! You need to do some research before you make such statements and paint two entire industrys with one paint brush!





Quote:
What are my options if I feel that they are deliberately devaluing my claim ?
Are you fixing the car? If you are what difference does the final cost make as long as it is fixed properly? explain that! I promise you that all shops are using the EXACT same parts...if you find a shop that tells you they NEVER use a/m, reman, or lkq/used parts..you've found a shop that is lying to you....



Quote:
The adjuster is definitely going to stick to the quote given by the bodyshop.
That's not true either! For one think I am a drp rep-for an insurance company I WRITE ALL THE ESTIMATES....NOT THE BODY SHOP!



Your response with data/proof to back up your statement are greatly anticipated.


_________________

"Never, never be afraid to do what's right, especially if the well being of a person or animal is at stake. Society's punishments are small compared to the wounds we inflict on our soul when we look the other way." Martin Luther King Jr.
Lori
Forum Expert
Leave a quick message

Lori
Forum Expert

Joined: 10 Sep 2007
Posts: 8080

Location: Missouri
287.93 Dollars($)

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2008 2:32 am   Post subject:   

If I had one in my area, I would use it, just because the insurance company would be really familiar with them too and I would trust that they would work together to get my vehicle back on the road as soon as possible, I did not understand the term at first, but I get it now, It just makes sense to use them if they are in the area. But of course it is always good to have the choice of where to go.

erb1953
Senior member
Leave a quick message



Joined: 30 Dec 2007
Posts: 248


1.30 Dollars($)

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 1:34 am   Post subject:   

Insurance companies try to steer(which is illegal) their customers to DRP shops because the company will save money if you go to that shop. They save money because they convince the shop that if they give them a discount on everything they will make up for it in volume. There are many, many things that the insurer whats from the shop, even the shop to pay tow bills and rentals. Insurers have basically ruined the collision business with DRP programs. They went from being a easy, convenient option for customers to being a way for insurers to totaly control a repair. The collision business has been invaded so badly by insurers that if a shop does not have a few Direct repair programs they stand little chance of staying in business. If they have no DRP's most work will be steered away from them anyway when the customer turns their claim in. It makes me sick that companies who lie and cheat anyone possible have ruined what used to be a good well paying profesion. The average NY autobody hourly rate is $44. This is absolutely ridiculous in todays world and what things cost. A spray booth is $60,000-$80,000, a frame machine with a measuring system is $40,000, basecoat is at least $30 a pint, clear is $100-$200 a gallon, a box of sand paper is $75 dollars, pay your staff, insurance, rent, all other utilities and that $44 a hour does not go too far. Not to mention that your techs have at least $10,000 in their own tools, but they haven't gotten a raise in 5 years because the labor rate hasn't gone up. What happens if you tell a insurer your rates are now $55? You get told some one down the street only charges $44 and they won't pay that rate. Collision techs are making less money now then they did 20 years ago. So next time all you people are cutting time off some guys estimate and telling him this is included and we don't pay for this or that, look at his toolbox that costs more than your company car and think about why this innocent guy gets screwed on every job, because of you and your companies policies. Also, what gives a adjuster who has never repaired a car in his life the right to tell some one who has years and years of experience and training how to repair something and how long it takes. Nothing, he has no right at all. I don't care how many ICAR classes you take if you have never done the work you don't tell me how to do my job.

Bodybyfischer
New member
Leave a quick message



Joined: 20 Jan 2008
Posts: 8


6.45 Dollars($)

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 2:21 am   Post subject:   

Quote:
Insurance companies try to steer(which is illegal) their customers to DRP shops because the company will save money if you go to that shop. They save money because they convince the shop that if they give them a discount on everything they will make up for it in volume.




I can't speak for all companies, but I can speak in general for one company. This company recommends a direct repair program shop but if the customer mentions another shop they'd like to use, then the direct repair program is no longer pushed. Steering IS illegal, you are right, and we don't practice it. The direct repair program shops are setup for customer convenience, where a customer can get in and get an estimate written right away, put them in a rental if needed, and get the repairs underway.



Quote:
There are many, many things that the insurer whats from the shop, even the shop to pay tow bills and rentals. Insurers have basically ruined the collision business with DRP programs. They went from being a easy, convenient option for customers to being a way for insurers to totaly control a repair.




You cannot paint all insurance companies with one brush, as much as this topic is very volatile. There are a lot of insurance companies that do not request any discounts, they pay their own tow bills and they pay their own rentals. This would be like saying all body shops are going to rip a customer off. You know as well as I do that that is not true. And neither is the fact that all insurance companies are out to ruin all body shops.



Quote:
The collision business has been invaded so badly by insurers that if a shop does not have a few DRP's they stand little chance of staying in business. If they have no DRP's most work will be steered away from them anyway when the customer turns their claim in. It makes me sick that companies who lie and cheat anyone possible have ruined what used to be a good well paying profesion.




I know several shops that do not have any Direct repair programs and they do very well. They are in a market where there is a lot of work though. And guess who pays the bill on the repairs? The insurance company. As far as good well paying profession, it still is. I work with many million dollar+ shops. If there was no money left in the industry, then where are these guys making a profit?



Quote:
The average NY autobody hourly rate is $44. This is absolutely ridiculous in todays world and what things cost. A spray booth is $60,000-$80,000, a frame machine with a measuring system is $40,000, basecoat is at least $30 a pint, clear is $100-$200 a gallon, a box of sand paper is $75 dollars, pay your staff, insurance, rent, all other utilities and that $44 a hour does not go too far. Not to mention that your techs have at least $10,000 in their own tools, but they haven't gotten a raise in 5 years because the labor rate hasn't gone up. What happens if you tell a insurer your rates are now $55? You get told some one down the street only charges $44 and they won't pay that rate. Collision techs are making less money now then they did 20 years ago.




I feel your pain here. I haven't had a decent raise in years either. The insurance companies are making billions of dollars a year, and getting tight everywhere. Bonuses? Ha! Wish I knew what that was. With that being said, it isn't the insurance company that sets the rates. It's the auto body shops. If you look at some states compared to others, where the metropolitan area is not as big as others, yet they make more, it is because the body shops in that state copied one another and raised prices across the board.



If you feel that that labor rate is not fair, correct me if I am wrong, but is there not a way all the body shops in that region can do the same thing by raising prices across the board? If Joe Doe has a shop in Podunk and charges $42, but Mike Blank in Metroville charges $48, then someone needs to change! Because unless Podunk raises it's prices, when the insurance company does its survey, the insurance company is going to average those two shops and whammo! Your're stuck in the middle.



Quote:
So next time all you people are cutting time off some guys estimate and telling him this is included and we don't pay for this or that, look at his toolbox that costs more than your company car and think about why this innocent guy gets screwed on every job, because of you and your companies policies.




First of all, we don't look at the guy's toolbox. We don't look at the car he drives or whether or not he lives in a half million home. We write the estimate per the estimating systems. Some things are included and others aren't. It's your job to show the tech what is included, instead of blaming the insurance company all the time. If it is not an included operation and you can show this to the adjuster then he's going to allow it. If he is not allowing it, he is doing himself and the insurance company a disservice because it's his job to bring the car back to pre-loss condition.



On the flip side, I know there are insurance companies that have outlandish objectives for their DRPs to make where a shop will feel that they are being squeezed.



Quote:
Also, what gives a adjuster who has never repaired a car in his life the right to tell someone who has years and years of experience and training how to repair something and how long it takes. Nothing, he has no right at all. I don't care how many ICAR classes you take if you have never done the work you don't tell me how to do my job.




In the same respect, what gives the body shop estimator the right to write an estimate when he has never repaired a car? I've seen shop estimators that have never turned a wrench, never repaired a car and yet they are writing sheets on vehicles. Where are their qualifications? How can this particular person relate to the tech and know whether or not the tech is telling the truth.



Yes, I will agree with you that there are insurance adjusters who should not be out in the field writing but it works both ways.


_________________

-- Jake



Auto Body and Direct Repair Questions & Answers
AutoBodybyJake
New member
Leave a quick message



Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 39


17.13 Dollars($)

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 2:23 am   Post subject:   

Quote:
Let me see if I can clear up a few things re: DRP's...




Lori, just wanted to say fantastic answer! I wish I had something to add to it!


_________________

-- Jake



Auto Body and Direct Repair Questions & Answers
AutoBodybyJake
New member
Leave a quick message



Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 39


17.13 Dollars($)

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 2:52 am   Post subject:   

I know there are a few good companies out there. State Farm is about the only company I have some respect for. I have had just about every company try to stick it to me one time or another. The company that really gets to me is Progressive and the companies that hire ex Progressive staff to learn their slimy ways. I personally was insured with them and had to file a claim. It was the biggest nightmare I ever dealt with. I have been around this both business' my whole life. I have seen companies do things that are just plain wrong and even illegal. You can act like it doesn't happen, and be a company man, but we both know what really goes on. Why do most companies want preliminary estimates as low as possible and everything supplemented. Because there is a chance that the customer will take the check and not repair the damage, thus short changing the customer. What about this USAA estimate I have sitting right next to me. '07 Mazda 3, bumper cracked needs replacement, adjuster deducted 1 hour from paint time for UPD scratches on opposite side of damage that was claimed. This bumper was damaged from the accident beyond repair and needs to be replaced, so why does it even matter if the other side had a scratch. Maybe we should just paint the new bumper drag it across the floor, and tell the customer thats the way it looked before the accident. I bet they would be happy with that. I can see deducting paint time on a repair panel for UPD, but not a replacement. I I don't have to worry about being fired from a insurance company so I do whatever I can to let people know how crooked the inusrance business is. There are some estimators that have never fixed a car, but most are guys that just wanted to get off the floor. A good shop wants a writer who knows what to do and how to get paid for everything.

Bodybyfischer
New member
Leave a quick message



Joined: 20 Jan 2008
Posts: 8


6.45 Dollars($)

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 6:58 am   Post subject:   

Hi, I meant no offense Lori, what I said is the general idea. You as an adjuster yourself may know the story behind the screen…………..but common people (like me) don't understand all this intricacies. I know about people, who are expressing their rues over the work done by the body shops. Well, that may be only few instances (accepting your view that it is not the normal practice Smile ) . You personally might not have lowballed any claim in your entire life …..but it's unfortunate that not all the professionals are like you.



Quote:
Insurance companies try to steer(which is illegal) their customers to DRP shops because the company will save money if you go to that shop. They save money because they convince the shop that if they give them a discount on everything they will make up for it in volume.




Well, it seems that I'm not the only one who has something to say against a direct repair program and I guess I preserve the right to have my own opinion. Very Happy

_________________
Register Now to have your Insurance queries solved.
Aurther
Guest







PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 7:02 am   Post subject:   

Quote:
What are my options if I feel that they are deliberately devaluing my claim ?

Are you fixing the car? If you are what difference does the final cost make as long as it is fixed properly?




No! just inquisitive to know about my options Smile You never know when you are required to encounter with such situations. Smile My insurance rate is already pretty high because of my age and an accident is the last thing that I want in the coming three years (at least).

_________________
Register Now to have your Insurance queries solved.
Aurther
Guest







PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 1:00 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
Hi, I meant no offense Lori, what I said is the general idea.
No offense at all taken by your remarks Aurther...I could tell you were seaching information which I tried to explain to you....no worries, I understood immediately the HUGE difference in yours and Bodybyfischer..
Quote:
You personally might not have lowballed any claim in your entire life …..but it's unfortunate that not all the professionals are like you.
agreed...just as it is not all body shops that deliver vehicles back to the owners with subpar work on their part, runs, dirt, fisheyes in the paint, washers and shims to level up panels, filler and paint on frame rails,...delivering vehicles after dark, hiding from customers when they have legitmate complaints regarding workmenship...

Quote:
Well, it seems that I'm not the only one who has something to say against the drp programs and I guess I preserve the right to have my own opinion.
You do indeed, I just ask that it be an educated informed opinion and not one based on unsubstantiated rantings..with zero documentation to back it up....that's all....oh, and that we don't sterotype an entire industry...I mean truthfully, (not saying you did), isn't that ALWAYS a statement of ignorance?





Steering is illegal, no argument here, but so is price fixing, charging for things/repairs that have not been completed, doctoring invoices, etc.!



It is not steering to give a person all the information and let them make their own EDUCATED decision....



Quote:
They save money because they convince the shop that if they give them a discount on everything they will make up for it in volume. There are many, many things that the insurer whats from the shop, even the shop to pay tow bills and rentals
I wish you could learn to use the words, 'some' all companies don't do this...the one I work for (for instance and certainly not the only ones!) do not have any discounts, certainly pay the tows and rentals...unless of course a shop drops the ball and due to their own negligence or shotty repairs a vehicle has to come back for re-work then the shop may be on the hook for the rental, but shouldn't they?



Quote:
Insurers have basically ruined the collision business with Direct repair programs
Another hysterical statement...they have also made many many more shops rich!



Quote:
insurers to totaly control a repair
And shouldn't they to some degree? Who's paying the bill? If there was no control, and you must admit this is right, there are shops out there that would be charging ten hours on a two hour dent...or replacing a bumper cover for 600 bucks that has a scratch....



Quote:
The collision business has been invaded so badly by insurers
again this is so funny...who is paying ALL OF YOUR BILLS? How many (percentage wise) customer pays do you do?

Quote:
It makes me sick that companies who lie and cheat anyone possible have ruined what used to be a good well paying profesion


I'm sorry if your shop isn't doing well..sounds like you are in a huge market, and clearly have trouble getting along, so that would have a lot to do with your income I'm sure..But here in the midwest, the 'average' body tech makes more than 60k per year....and the larger shops over 100k...no problem here...it's still a good paying profession...



Quote:
The average NY autobody hourly rate is $44
Apparently you are in a flooded market, because the rates in the midwest are 46, and getting ready to move again.....who's fault is this? It's the market you're in! geeeeeeeeeeze is that so hard to see? Some areas are still as low as 28.00 why? Talk with your fellow body shop owners for that question, they are the ones cutting your throat not the carriers. you said it yourself...

Quote:
You get told some one down the street only charges $44
And if they quality is near the same, what do you think the average Joe would do if there were no insurance payments and he is paying out of his own pocket? I'll tell you, you would have zero work...

Quote:
Also, what gives a adjuster who has never repaired a car in his life the right to tell some one who has years and years of experience and training how to repair something and how long it takes
You don't have to be a chicken to know a bad egg when you see it....fyi, I was both a tech and body shop manager for a very large shop for several years, so 'I" do know what I'm talking about....

Quote:
telling him this is included and we don't pay for this or that, look at his toolbox that costs more than your company car and think about why this innocent guy gets screwed on every job, because of you and your companies policies.
GEEZE, you and I both know that insurance companies don't make these rules...they are pre-set by the estimating system..which one do you use? Do you not know your own system well enough to know what is and is not an included operation? Or, if they adjuster does make the mistake, and pays you twice for an operation, I'm sure you will immediately bring this to his/her attention right?

Quote:
A spray booth is $60,000-$80,000, a frame machine with a measuring system is $40,000, basecoat is at least $30 a pint, clear is $100-$200 a gallon, a box of sand paper is $75 dollars, pay your staff, insurance, rent, all other utilities
This is the cost of doing business that you chose! Period...Do I look to see how much the plumber has invested in his equipment? Or maybe the corner deli, I go back and check out his ice boxes, and stoves? Please...it's called overhead, and for those that don't know this IT IS ALL WRITTEN OFF EITHER DEPRECIATED FROM YOUR INCOME TAXES AND ON THE TECH LEVEL THEY TOO GET A DEDUCTION FOR THEIR TOOLS, IF THEY DON'T THEY NEED TO FIND A BETTER TAX PREPARER OR ACCOUNTANT!





Quote:
I know there are a few good companies out there. State Farm is about the only company I have some respect for.
Ok, here's the deal, I hear this across this great country and it appears to be a regional thing...in one area the shops hate state farm, and love progressive, go a state over and it reverses...it has more to do with the way things are handled or managed in that particular area, and down to the adjuster...you ought to know that...

Quote:
I have had just about every company try to stick it to me one time or another
Really? I've had about every shop I go into for the first time try and stick it to me too! Petite little gal comes in surely she don't know much, here you go, ''honey'' this car has all kinds of unibody trouble, just look at this hood gaps, we are going to need about six hours frame time'' then i ask for tram gauges, and they about puken themselves...so don't tell me that insurance companies are the only ones that do this!
Quote:
I have been around this both business' my whole life.
me too....

Quote:
I have seen companies do things that are just plain wrong and even illegal
again me too, and I've see shops do the same...My point is why can't you admit (as I can about shops) that they ALL DON'T...THAT NOT EVEN A HIGH PERCENTAGE DO....if you saw something 'illegal'' it was your responsibility to report it..did you?

Quote:
Why do most companies want preliminary estimates as low as possible and everything supplemented.
They don't...if you are talking about an adjuster looking at a car prior to any tear down, at an owners home....or you just can't tear it down...what are we to do...''assume'' something is damaged and pay it? NOT...nor would you if you yourself were paying it...tell you what next time, you or one of your techs damages anothers vehicle in some incident that you yourself would be paying it...lets say a rear cover is hit, lets not tear it down, and pay the guy for a cover, absorber, rebar, and repair the rear body panel while we're at it....
Quote:
What about this USAA estimate I have sitting right next to me. '07 Mazda 3, bumper cracked needs replacement, adjuster deducted 1 hour from paint time for UPD scratches on opposite side of damage that was claimed. This bumper was damaged from the accident beyond repair and needs to be replaced, so why does it even matter if the other side had a scratch.
This is incorrect in anyones book, and the adjuster has made a mistake, if the panel required replacement due to this loss, their should not be any betterment charged....and you should bring this to the adjusters attention...
Quote:
Maybe we should just paint the new bumper drag it across the floor, and tell the customer thats the way it looked before the accident.
pretty cute analogy though, i have heard it before, it does make sense, you or the customer should talk to the adjuster or his/her supervisor regarding this particular case...come on, you make no mistakes? and besides that if he were charging betterment it shouldn't just be on the refinish side, he should've charged some repair time as well.....
Quote:
I don't have to worry about being fired from a insurance company so I do whatever I can to let people know how crooked the inusrance business is
And you should if there is a particular problem, but i'd be mighty careful if I were you when you generalize like this...



Quote:
There are some estimators that have never fixed a car, but most are guys that just wanted to get off the floor. A good shop wants a writer who knows what to do and how to get paid for everything.
that they do! and not to be paid for things they don't do right?



What about the shops that charge (for instance) to detrim a door, and I make an unannounced drop in the vehicle is in the booth, or just been sprayed and the idiots taped everything off? huh? what about them? Is this not lying and theiving? of course it is...but I"M NOT MAINTAINING THAT ALL SHOPS ARE THAT WAY! But there are some that are...I suppose you are going to say that's it's ok, since the big bad ins company ALWAYS screws the poor body shop right? Two wrongs make a right? If that is your stance that is unethical and you know it.....You are owed for what you do, and no more!



All I would like to see you admit, is that there are some/many damn good adjusters out there, that pay a fair price for the work the shop does. I'm sorry but, if you can only find one company in the entire state of NY that you can get along with, this has to be a problem with you, and your shop...think about it....can everyone always be wrong and you are right? Can EVERYONE be a crook but you? Frankly with statefarms new drp guidelines I'm surprised you get along with them, or maybe it hasn't made it to you yet....I think their coming in and going thru all your claims to make sure you are giving them the lowest rate is unethical, but you get along with them.....interesting.....



For the record, I would jump to the defense of your industry (or any other for that matter) were these broad rangeing stereotypcial remarks made against it as well....why not just say ALL GREEN EYED PEOPLE ARE CROOKS!...... makes about as much sense, and yes, I have green eyes.........



Quote:
Lori, just wanted to say fantastic answer! I wish I had something to add to it!
Thanks Jake, you did and I appreciate it...this one sided non-sense is ridiculous...


_________________

"Never, never be afraid to do what's right, especially if the well being of a person or animal is at stake. Society's punishments are small compared to the wounds we inflict on our soul when we look the other way." Martin Luther King Jr.
Lori
Forum Expert
Leave a quick message

Lori
Forum Expert

Joined: 10 Sep 2007
Posts: 8080

Location: Missouri
287.93 Dollars($)

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:49 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
I know there are a few good companies out there.


You must have missed this sentence. Go back and read it again. I never said ALL adjusters were crooks or EVERY company was. Just like when MOST adjusters read a supplement they read what THEY want to read and ignore the rest. Just to let you people know my father is a adjuster and has been for thirty years. I know alot of adjusters his age who are honest guys, and work with shops. I see you like to put words in my mouth so I'll specify the kind of adjusters I refer to. The people that Progressive and the Progressive wanna be companies that hire people straight out of college with no background in any automotive field, they then send them to a few weeks training and then they are out in the field writing half ass estimate. I know a Progressive adjuster who's only job was working in a Thom McCann shoe store prior to working at Progressive. Jake and Lori you are obviously offended when true facts are stated. I'm also not so ignorant that I do not know there are hack shops doing things wrong. Keep denying my facts if it makes you happy. Should I post some Pics to defend myself?
Bodybyfischer
New member
Leave a quick message



Joined: 20 Jan 2008
Posts: 8


6.45 Dollars($)

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 6:18 pm   Post subject:   

Quote:
Jake and Lori you are obviously offended when true facts are stated




Woah there tiger. Back up a second. Point out where I was offended by the statement of a "true" fact? I'm not offended in the least.



Now I AM passionate about this business, from all angles, as I have replied. Don't mistake my passion for being offended. Smile I don't know you, I can't possibly be offended by our discussion unless of course you called me some inappropriate name. Very Happy Your father and I might see eye to eye, and I prefer to think of myself as an honest guy too and I do my best to work with all my shops. Heck, I'm probably the same age as your dad, how old is he? Smile



Lori and I also seem to be cut from the same thread and prefer to do our jobs with integrity.



Now I have not had a chance to answer your other posts, and am in the middle of my work day, but later this evening when I've had a chance to relax from the cold, I'll digest what has been said in this thread so far and attempt to be as objective as possible. Which up to now, I believe I have been.


_________________

-- Jake



Auto Body and Direct Repair Questions & Answers
AutoBodybyJake
New member
Leave a quick message



Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 39


17.13 Dollars($)

Quick Reply
Your Name
Subject
Message body
All times are GMT
1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next  
Page 1 of 5


Get a Quote
Ask Community Experts

flash plugin

Quick Links

Must See

Community

Hot topics in forums

Latest in blogs

AmPmInsure on Facebook



Page loaded in 0.425 seconds.